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Goodbye Charlie

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Guest F_Black

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Guest F_Black

Gotta question on this ep. It's one of my favorites.

The painting of Greeks eating walnuts: In early scenes we see a black spot where a character has been blanked out. At the end, we see what appears to be Kiley inside the painting in that spot. I don't get this. Does he go inside the painting?

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Greek mythology records that Carya, (the Latin genus name for walnut), who fell in love with the Greek God, Dionysus, was transformed into a walnut tree at her death.

I don't know if this helps to "crack" the code for this episode, but I think it is interesting. I really don't like "Good Bye Charlie" I think it's because of the kareeokee, and the topic of euthinasia. Another reason for me to not like the show is that the song "Seasons in the Sun" is used in the show, and that song was on all the am pop stations right around the time one of my best friends was killed on hiw 16th birthday. It brings back sad times.

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Guest F_Black

Sympathies about your friend.

Still, it's one of my favorites. Partly because of how unresolved it all was, I guess. The karaoke thing is odd, to be sure, but I think it kind of goes into the character of Kiley as kind of a nice goofball. Watching the ep, he plays his goofy act when most people are around, EXCEPT the terminally ill people and, during the interrogation, Frank and Lara. (And the person at the end of the crisis line phone)

You can see this as an act in the interrogation scene. He converses pleasantly, if not terribly seriously ("Either of you into Bobby. . .?") at first, but then at a certain point he cuts the act and becomes serious and starts teaching them about that "other plane".

But the painting still bugs me. I assume that when they're tipped off about the bar waitress and they rush in before he finishes, that he just sort of vanishes (into the painting?) by falling into that other plane. And at the end, he similarly vanishes.

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I always just thought the painting was symbolic for him, and that he "saw himself" in it, and so the fact that there was someone in the painting that looked like him did not mean it WAS him, but it showed us how he Saw himself. After all, that's what Frank's "gift" is, isn't it? He sees into the minds of others to a point where he understands how they see themselves and how they see the world.

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BEER----> Just noticing some TV trailers for a cable program on Comedy Central. Sara Silverman is getting her own show and the main character from our "Goodbye Charlie" show is in the trailer. This new program starts soon, I'll have to check it out.

BELCH

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Guest MillenniumIsBliss
BEER----> Just noticing some TV trailers for a cable program on Comedy Central. Sara Silverman is getting her own show and the main character from our "Goodbye Charlie" show is in the trailer. This new program starts soon, I'll have to check it out.

BELCH

Believe it or not, I have just recently been made aware of Sarah Silverman. I saw her hosting the "Spirit Awards" for independent films. For some reason, I came across the show and became very interested. Now I want to see movies like Little Miss Sunshine. Anyways, Sarah was on it and did a great job. She was very funny, and really adorable. Something about her is very attractive. I was also surprised by Minnie Driver. I found out a couple of years ago that she was a singer, in addition to being a very good actress. Minnie did a cute little song and really has a great voice. She didn't sound like an actress trying to sing. She sounded like a competent singer. Anyways, I will be keeping my eyes open for Sarah S. in the future.

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  • 4 months later...
Guest Jim McLean
I always just thought the painting was symbolic for him, and that he "saw himself" in it, and so the fact that there was someone in the painting that looked like him did not mean it WAS him, but it showed us how he Saw himself. After all, that's what Frank's "gift" is, isn't it? He sees into the minds of others to a point where he understands how they see themselves and how they see the world.

I don't think that's quite right so far as it is the actor in the painting - and its fairly clear the production means it to be him. I think its just a method of telling the audience that he's not just legged it; that he has transcended away from this plain. It just tells us - and Frank - that his role is more than just a human killer; he is part of a larger game. Maybe the symbolism to prophecy extends to his role as much as the tools in his role.

I certainly wasn't him "leaping into the painting" as the image of his face is present on the painting throughout (yes, I checked), and the earlier instance, he's meant to have run (the back door is open).

Clearly his connection with this other plane gives him a higher understanding of what his role offers, just whether that was good or for bad is another question entirely.

I'd love to hear more opinion on this. I'm not saying I know all this for fact, merely my interpretation, and its open to change if someone can present a deeper understanding!

Just how much of what we were told about Steven throughout the episode was erroneous to the implied calling we are told of at the end?

Edited by Jim McLean
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I don't think that's quite right so far as it is the actor in the painting - and its fairly clear the production means it to be him. I think its just a method of telling the audience that he's not just legged it; that he has transcended away from this plain. It just tells us - and Frank - that his role is more than just a human killer; he is part of a larger game. Maybe the symbolism to prophecy extends to his role as much as the tools in his role.

I certainly wasn't him "leaping into the painting" as the image of his face is present on the painting throughout (yes, I checked), and the earlier instance, he's meant to have run (the back door is open).

Clearly his connection with this other plane gives him a higher understanding of what his role offers, just whether that was good or for bad is another question entirely.

I'd love to hear more opinion on this. I'm not saying I know all this for fact, merely my interpretation, and its open to change if someone can present a deeper understanding!

Just how much of what we were told about Steven throughout the episode was erroneous to the implied calling we are told of at the end?

If i remember right, there is a part where he says "I have been sent here"....now, at the end, there is debate between Frank and Lara about whether or not he was an angel or a devil, the issue never being fully resolved....i believe that if you look closely at an earlier "flash" where the painting is in the background you can clearly see that it is the same face as at the end of the episode. Maybe i am confused, but i dont believe that ALL of the cases were terminal...if i remember right, didnt one say in his farewell note that he/she did not have the finances to pursue a cure any further?? I will have to go back and watch it again...what i CLEARLY remember is Lara looking at Frank as they back out of the driveway with a lustful "come take me now you beast" look....LOL

4th Horseman...

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  • 1 month later...

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