Frank's doesn't have psychic visions?

[Libby]

I've never been happy with the idea that Frank is psychic. That for me takes the show too much away from the realism aspect. However, I do know there are people who can pick up minutiae that I don't - from their surroundings, from the way people behave, the way they speak, all very subtle clues that pass me by completely. I've always seen Frank as being exceptionally good at that, so it wasn't surprising that he went into law enforcement where, in real life, being able to spot those subtle clues is important. (Also in other careers as well.)

As for Jordan - it's perfectly possible for her to have inherited the ability to perceive subtle things. Obviously not as refined as Frank and she doesn't have experiences, but the episode "Sacrament" is, I think, the first episode where we begin to see there's something rather different about her. Although Frank's sister-in-law hadn't yet been kidnapped, Jordan is crying and saying "He's hurting her, Daddy!". I take it that she could sense from the kidnapper's and Helen's behaviours/facial expressions that things are not good, even though at that stage there's no obvious signs for the other adults around Helen to pick up.

As a possible explanation, it works for me. But of course one of the marks of a good show/book/etc. is that different people can have different views.

[Guest Moriarty]

As for Jordan - it's perfectly possible for her to have inherited the ability to perceive subtle things. Obviously not as refined as Frank and she doesn't have experiences, but the episode "Sacrament" is, I think, the first episode where we begin to see there's something rather different about her.

I cannot agree on this Libby. The first episode where we begin to see that there is something different about her is actually in the pilot when she has that high fever that suddenly vanishes. It is subtle but the hint that she is kind of "special" is there. Actually, the gift of Jordan is one of the few things that has been dealt with during the 3 seasons. It is also one of the few things that Morgan and Wong picked up from season 1 when they became showrunners in the second season.

Edited May 22, 2007 by Moriarty

[Guest ZeusFaber]

I don't agree with that, Moriarty. I don't think Jordan's sickness in the pilot was meant as anything more than to show the vulnerability of Frank's family, and also to assist in the taking blood image which sparked Frank's deductions. I don't think it was deliberately intended to point to anything more, just that it was given this significance after the fact to clever effect in "Borrowed Time".

[Guest Moriarty]

I don't agree with that, Moriarty. I don't think Jordan's sickness in the pilot was meant as anything more than to show the vulnerability of Frank's family, and also to assist in the taking blood image which sparked Frank's deductions. I don't think it was deliberately intended to point to anything more, just that it was given this significance after the fact to clever effect in "Borrowed Time".

Well, I do not agree. I really feel that there was a hint in the Pilot regarding Jordan her gift. And I am positive that I read an interview online a couple of years ago with Chris Carter on that subject. Anyway, it came up again in "Sacrament", as Libby stated.

I agree that it was nicely picked up in "Borrowed Time" and certainly her gift was more explored in "Saturn Dreaming Of Mercury". But Morgan and Wong also used the arc of Jordan her abilities in the second season. I think that it is in "The Time Is Now" that Peter says to Frank that "your daughter just doesn't dream".

Anyway, opinions are personal but there is a link between Frank his abilities and Jordan her illness in the Pilot according to me.

Cheers.

[HighPlainsDrifter]

I am torn between Zeus and Moriarty thoughts and insight on this matter. I always thought that Jordan was a miracle child. If i remember right Jordan was a sick child but on the other hand had a gift, as seen in Sacrament. The sickness was another brick to hit Frank with. Frank is the pathetic hero. He pays the price for what he does. If i remember right again, Catherine wasnt able to have children. Then in season 2 M&W took it a step further with Jordan

[Guest Laurent.]

I really like the way HighPlainsDrifter sees the whole Jordan storyline. It's pretty clear to me that Jordan wasn't just sensible to others' feelings but was more or less a "psychic" (c'mon! seeing angels is a lot more than being sensible). Yet, like Libby said about Frank, it really takes the show out of reality. I can still deal with Frank being an experienced and sensible profiler but not his young innocent daughter.

As far as I'm concerned, the realism of the show is not that important. I'd miss episodes like Saturn Dreaming of Mercury too much if Jordan didn't had the "gift".

[Guest ZeusFaber]

Well, I do not agree. I really feel that there was a hint in the Pilot regarding Jordan her gift. And I am positive that I read an interview online a couple of years ago with Chris Carter on that subject. Anyway, it came up again in "Sacrament", as Libby stated.

I agree that it was nicely picked up in "Borrowed Time" and certainly her gift was more explored in "Saturn Dreaming Of Mercury". But Morgan and Wong also used the arc of Jordan her abilities in the second season. I think that it is in "The Time Is Now" that Peter says to Frank that "your daughter just doesn't dream".

Anyway, opinions are personal but there is a link between Frank his abilities and Jordan her illness in the Pilot according to me.

Cheers.

I certainly can't argue with the fact that, as the series went on, Jordan was definitely portrayed to be something more than a normal child. Like you say, episodes like "Sacrament" bring this up for the first time and it is later expanded in "Midnight of the Century" and "Saturn Dreaming of Mercury".

All I'm saying is that I don't believe it was the intension from the pilot. If you find any comments from Chris Carter on this though, I'd be very eager to hear them.

[Guest Doll]

Well, I do not agree. I really feel that there was a hint in the Pilot regarding Jordan her gift. And I am positive that I read an interview online a couple of years ago with Chris Carter on that subject.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

i think you are right abt the interview, i think i saw it in the special interviews on the dvds. Carter does indicate that the mysterious afflictions are b/c Jordan was such a special kid & that's why no causes were found for them.

I think you're mistaken about that. There's no mention of it in Chris Carter's audio commentary. The only bits I can find relating to it in the bonus featurettes is the following:

Frank Spotnitz: "I can see why people thought there was a psychic component to it. Because it was certainly hinted that his daughter, Jordan, had the same “gift”, if you will. Early on, there was a Morgan and Wong episode, very effective, where it was hinted that Jordan had the same ability. And then it was expanded upon in an episode that I wrote later in the first season, called “Sacrament”. At least for me, and I think for Chris, we never wanted to cross the line into the supernatural with any of that. It was more about an exquisite sensitivity to the way some people think, to the monstrous way some people think.

These comments are also useful:

John Peter Kousakis: "Frank Black was not a psychic. It’s misconception on the audience’s part and a lot of the critics..."

Lance Henriksen:"We never, ever, used the term, “Frank was psychic.” That came from the outside. I thought of him as anything but."

[Guest Laurent.]

I REALLY don't think it was Carter's intention to give a hint about Jordan's gift in the pilot. Knowing what happened in the following seasons and going back to look at Jordan's mysterious illness... I can conceive that some of you may think that it was a kind of foreshadowing of Jordan's abilities. But Carter did not even considered (and didn't want the audience to consider) Frank as a psychic. So would he really write Frank's daughter as a miracle, psychic child? The guy didn't want any paranormal elements to the series in the first place. Millennium was suppose to be a down-to-earth about human and earthly evil. There's no way he even thought of turning Jordan into a powerful evil-sensitive psychic.