There is definately something wrong with the human race

[4th Horseman]

A few facts...(source is https://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Facts.asp).

1. One half of the world's population lives on less than 2 dollars/day.

2. 1.7 million children die annually due to poverty.

3. In the U.S., 12.7 percent of the population live in poverty.

4. In the U.S., children represent 25% of the total population, but 35% of those who are classified as poor. Of those, the poverty rate for African American children is 26.1%, for Asians it is 12.5%, for Hispanics the rate is 25.6%, and for non-hispanic whites, the average is 8.2%

5. 33 million Americans live in households that do not have an adequate supply of food.

6. According the the USDA, 1/5 of America's food goes to waste. That calculates to 130 pounds of food per person. The loss is 31 billions dollars a year, but the sad fact is that nearly 49 million people could have been by these lost resources...

I could go on and on, but the reason i am posting this is i just came across this nugget which serves as a classic case of contraindication..and Joe, we should both be very, very ashamed right now to be baseball fans..as reported by The Associated Press one hour ago..

Mets, Santana Agree to $150.75M Contract

By MIKE FITZPATRICK – 1 hour ago

NEW YORK (AP) — Johan Santana is a money pitcher, and the New York Mets are paying for it. Santana and the Mets agreed Friday to a $137.5 million, six-year contract, a record for a pitcher and the last major step needed to complete the team's blockbuster trade with Minnesota.

After the sides were granted an extra two hours to work on a deal, the Mets announced about 30 minutes before the new 7 p.m. EST deadline that negotiations had concluded. The two-time Cy Young Award winner was scheduled to take a physical Saturday.

Terms of the agreement were disclosed by a baseball official with knowledge of the talks who spoke on condition of anonymity because no announcement had been made. The deal includes deferred money and a club option for 2014 with a $5.5 million buyout that could make the contract worth about $150 million over seven seasons. Depending on Santana's performance, the option could become guaranteed.

The acquisition of Santana for four prospects gives New York the durable ace it has sorely lacked while chasing a pennant the past two years.

The Mets came within one win of the World Series in 2006 despite an injury-depleted pitching staff, then missed the playoffs last season after blowing a seven-game lead in the NL East with 17 to play.

Now, New York is a National League favorite again. As long as players in the trade pass physicals, Santana will lead a rotation that includes three-time Cy Young Award winner Pedro Martinez, crafty right-hander Orlando Hernandez and a pair of 15-game winners from last season: John Maine and Oliver Perez.

The lineup includes 2007 All-Stars David Wright, Jose Reyes and Carlos Beltran, plus veteran sluggers Carlos Delgado and Moises Alou. Hard-throwing closer Billy Wagner anchors the bullpen.

Santana is 93-44 with a 3.22 ERA in eight major league seasons, winning the AL Cy Young Award in 2004 and 2006 with the Twins. He has been less successful in the playoffs, going 1-3 with a 3.97 ERA.

The left-hander slipped a bit last year, finishing with a 15-13 record that included marks of 0-5 against AL Central champion Cleveland and 1-3 vs. Detroit. He dropped seven of his final 11 decisions as his ERA rose from 2.60 to 3.33 ERA, his highest since 2001. He also allowed a career-high 33 homers — most in the AL.

"He's good but he's not unbeatable. He got hit around last year," said pitcher Tim Hudson of the Atlanta Braves, one of the Mets' chief rivals in the NL East along with Philadelphia. "We've just got to be concerned about ourselves. We can't be consumed by what anyone else does."

Santana's contract topped the previous mark for pitchers, set when Barry Zito received a $126 million, seven-year deal from the San Francisco Giants last offseason. Santana was due $13.25 million in the final year of his contract with the Twins, and would have been eligible for free agency after the World Series.

The only players with larger packages are New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez ($275 million), Yankees shortstop Derek Jeter ($189 million), Boston outfielder Manny Ramirez ($160 million) and Colorado first baseman Todd Helton ($141.5 million).

Santana's average annual salary of $22.92 million is second only to A-Rod's $27.5 million. Among pitchers with multiyear contracts, it topped the $18.3 million of the Chicago Cubs' Carlos Zambrano.

175 million dollars for a human being who works every 5th day. 175 million dollars for a guy who, when all is said and done, and excluding training, only works (takes the hill to pitch) 32-35 times a year...lets break this down,shall we??? His salary per year is 25,125,000.00...divide that by 35 and you get nearly 718,000 per start. In 2007, Johan pitched 219 innings over 32 starts..that 3200 dollars/inning...or about 1,000 dollar per out...333.00 for every strike he throws...and on, and on, and on..all this while, as i stated earlier, half of the world lives on 2 dollars or less/day...

Justified? I guess if we consider that if the market can bear it, might as well be as greedy as you can..unfortunately this attitude is prevalent throughout our society, from athletes to corporate executives...i guess before we condemn such avarice, we should really look in the mirror and ask outselves if we would'nt do the exact same thing....

4th Horseman....

[HighPlainsDrifter]

yeah i think its ridiculous. MLB is getting out of hand when it comes to overpaying players. i see alot of mediocre players getting way too much. Their should be a salary cap in MLB. Then we will stop the evil empire New York Yankees. I remember seeing something in the news some years ago about some law suit and the woman was paid-out way over the amount she was asking for. so guess what she finally did with all that money.......she donated it to a Autism Foundation and i think a Kidney Foundation. Pretty cool

[Beerbelch]

BEER----> I say good for him. Besides, we're dumb enough to buy the ticket and suds. My team (Angels) just put a value added price to the 'Premium' games. Yankee's etc.

Whatever the traffic will bear.

BELCH

[4th Horseman]

BEER----> I say good for him. Besides, we're dumb enough to buy the ticket and suds. My team (Angels) just put a value added price to the 'Premium' games. Yankee's etc.

Whatever the traffic will bear.

BELCH

Man, what a juicy topic. The tolerance of "get all you can" "strike while the iron's hot" vs the human qualities of compassion and immaculacy. Beer..I know its the way of the world, and i agree with you about the tickets and the suds..i have not been to a baseball game in years. I still have a few players i follow year in and year out, but as for a favorite team..hell no, there is no loyalty anymore in anything, whether it be on the baseball field or in the corporate boardroom. Two names ought to be stricken from the annuals of baseball forever, forbidden to even be mentioned and those are Marvin Miller and Scott Boras...when "what the market will bear" exceeds common sense, then it no longer can be supported from a protagonist viewpoint....

Belch, unfortunately, you have returned to the essential argument which drives the laissez-faire attitude of our democratic society. Profit!!!! As i said earlier, I have not been to a game in years, yet, if i watch a game on TV, am i not part of the problem?, because MLB gets billions in revenue streams from the networks..there is no answer, until we start having major league teams implode and go bankrupt.

A PERFECT example is the now-near defunct housing market, especially in our illustrious state of California. Did "market bearance" have anything to do with the record number of foreclosures we are having now? Or more simply, was it just all about freaking GREED, lenders giving money to people who had no business owning an animal, much less a house. Or was it the buyer, who bought into a neighborhood far exceeding his ability to pay the mortgage, riding on the tails of those 5 year interest free loans that were hung like crack in front of a drug addict, and now are BURIED under an ever increasing mortgage? Coutrywide having to be saved from bankruptcy by Bank of America, laying off 25% of its workforce across the country. Is "get what you can" responsible for this? "What the market will bear"??? Baseball seems to be strangely immune, as every year, teams report record attendance. With salaries spiralling up and up, and even with being held hostage by the oil companies at the gas pump (of whom, Exxon reported net income profits up 75% to 9.92 billion dollars, the most EVER by a U.S. company in a 3 month period, and revenues up 32.7% to 100.7 billion dollars. That is greater than the GDP of all but 38 of the entire world's economies)...the numbers show no significant decline in baseball's popularity. NOW....but remember this...do you remember when we thought 2.50 was a GOOD price for gas? Now, in California, if the price goes below 3.20 we all jump for joy...does anyone see the manipulation here??? pretty soon, we are all going to soil ourselves with joy when gas suddenly goes below the 5.00 mark...it is insipid, an invisible ascendancy on the part of the oil companies in collusion with their suppliers...

God, i have gotten off the track, haven't I!!!!!

anway, getting back to the mortage crisis...

We all knew Bletch, that this day would dawn, when the value of a $250,000 house 10 years ago would fall off of its ridiculously high $800,000 perch..There was no way in hell that it could be supported forever, but GREED and AVARICE did their best.. For a historical reference, all one has to do is sojurn down memory lane to Christmases remembered where we witnessed the chaos and rioting over the "hot" toy of the season, whether it was a Tickle me Elmo figure, or a Cabbage Patch doll, and now, its not hard to see why covetness and greed will be our legacy.

So in the end, i guess we as a populace just need to sit back, wait for our meds to kick in, and nod our heads yes in agreement when asked if we want more peas at dinner...i origionally posted this as nothing more than a delicious contradiction in the comparison between the rapacious proclivity of "what the market will bear" and the stark black and white facts that 35% of our children go to bed hungry...not much of a legacy i dare say...

4th Horseman...

[hippyroo]

First, what does living under the poverty line mean in the US? It means you have cable TV, play station for you kid, you might drive a small 6 year old Ford instead of a new $50,000 truck, and that you more likely eat out out McDonals's, Burger King, and Wendy's instead of Macaroni Grill, Texas Road House, or some local joint. Yes, there are some families that really struggle, often it is because they do not take advantage of what is availible or there is substance abuse involved. I've been there. I remember a time when the only food in the house was some oatmeal and some Carnation instant milk (cheaper than real milk) for the weekend. But part of that was because I wouldn't sign up for food stamps. My point is you can't start talking about real poverty in places like Africa and then just lump it together with US poverty. In some countries people do starve to death'; that is extreamly rare in the US.

Greed does exist, and it seems better to use greed to get people to work and contribute than to stifle it. People will work if they see something in it for them; that's greed at work. Where more egalitarian approaches have been used production goes down. Like in communism - you keep pretending to work and we'll keep pretending to pay you. Or in socialism where students protest when it is suggested they could be fired for not working.

It is sad when those that make so much don't help others in need, but should it be law that they must? Before the 1920's people tended to take care of each other; hospitals were run by charities, familes took care of people in need, and philonthrphist built theatres and such. But now we expect the government to take care of people instead of charities.

There is no perfect system and "you will always have the poor", but letting people be successful and earn as much as they can seems just to me.

hmm rambled a bit didn't I?

[4th Horseman]

First, what does living under the poverty line mean in the US? It means you have cable TV, play station for you kid, you might drive a small 6 year old Ford instead of a new $50,000 truck, and that you more likely eat out out McDonals's, Burger King, and Wendy's instead of Macaroni Grill, Texas Road House, or some local joint. Yes, there are some families that really struggle, often it is because they do not take advantage of what is availible or there is substance abuse involved. I've been there. I remember a time when the only food in the house was some oatmeal and some Carnation instant milk (cheaper than real milk) for the weekend. But part of that was because I wouldn't sign up for food stamps. My point is you can't start talking about real poverty in places like Africa and then just lump it together with US poverty. In some countries people do starve to death'; that is extreamly rare in the US.

Greed does exist, and it seems better to use greed to get people to work and contribute than to stifle it. People will work if they see something in it for them; that's greed at work. Where more egalitarian approaches have been used production goes down. Like in communism - you keep pretending to work and we'll keep pretending to pay you. Or in socialism where students protest when it is suggested they could be fired for not working.

It is sad when those that make so much don't help others in need, but should it be law that they must? Before the 1920's people tended to take care of each other; hospitals were run by charities, familes took care of people in need, and philonthrphist built theatres and such. But now we expect the government to take care of people instead of charities.

There is no perfect system and "you will always have the poor", but letting people be successful and earn as much as they can seems just to me.

hmm rambled a bit didn't I?

We used to agree all the time!! Is this the end for us??? Which one is going over to the dark side. (me, me, oh,oh..me)

Go back and re-read my post my friend..!!!.. I SAID I was only bringing up the extremes as a function of our society. I disagree with your assessment that everyone who is poor has a Playstation. Without knowing how they came about it..perhaps it was a gift, perhaps given as charity from a friend..to assume that it was bought WHILE on poverty i think really is stretching it a bit, dont you??Perhaps you meant it facetiously...

...and by the way, feeding a family of 4 now at McDonalds, Bk, or any other fast food establishment these days requires a bigger piggy bank..the average meal for four is around 23-25 dollars..a lot of money when you are looking at pinching pennies...But you are right about some things...PROFIT!!!!...If i needed any more of a reality slap, i would post my MillenniuM memorabilia on Ebay, sit back, and watch people scrurry about outbidding each other..Hey, i am as democratic as the next person...show me the money!!!! And, i have to nod in agreement as well with your assessment of the issue of comparing countries, poverty wise...that was not my intention as i clearly defined that in my post. My only statement concerning worldwide issues was statment of fact #1 and #2...all the rest dealt with our problems here in the good ol' U S of A...

There is no perfect system and "you will always have the poor", but letting people be successful and earn as much as they can seems just to me.

Tell that to my friend who was an innocent victim of the Countrywide greed fiasco who now is looking for a job..I bet you could classify him as "impoverished"...let those corportate executives, who should be in jail for their wanton criminal activity, stupidity and avarice take "early out" packages that pay them millions in stock options, etc all the while KNOWING that the day was coming when it would all come crashing down..but let them retire with no consequences..all the while strewing behind them the carcasses of layed off employees, who by the way i am sure have families...yeah, i agree with you, earn as much as you can....woo-hoo...AT ALL COSTS...

p.s - now where is that MillenniuM autographed script..EBAY beckons...

"anyone who lives within their means, suffers from a lack of imagination" - Oscar Wilde....

4th Horseman...

[Beerbelch]

BEER---> Fair enough. It's a tremenous cycle. Does the fan create the $ or does the player, owner - whatever? When you go out in the workforce, you don't say 'I want to be 2nd or 3rd' ?

I want to pay as much money as I can to the IRS every year, cause if they get a lot - that means I earned a lot of money. I want my fair share.

Anybody that signs a piece paper that says - you will be paying triple what you are paying at the bebinning has no common sense. Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of unscroupulous(sp) people out there, so ya goota beware.

BELCH

[hippyroo]

perhaps I went too far with the play station Hyperbole? I am saying that US poor have more than shelter, food, and warmth; while the real poor in the world face real deprivation.

I get more upset with what people spend on their pets, or for 16 year old's birthday parties than I do with what entertainers make. But again, it's their money.

Taxes? The top 1% of US taxpayers pay a third of the total taxes collected by the government. Of course most of us think we pay too much and that too much of it is misspent. Instead of your employer taking taxes out of your check, I wish you had to write a check to each tax (fed, state, ss, medi). Then people might start thinking of it as their money.

[HighPlainsDrifter]

my family struggle at times but we always seem to get through it. Like now my heating furnace isnt working, something is wrong and i sure dont know how to fix it. The money we have put aside right now is for our Aruba trip, so i am gonna call my brother in law and have him look at it. I also heard today on the news that they expect gas prices as high as $4 in the summer time here in St.Louis,MO

[HighPlainsDrifter]

On the baseball note, last year i went to 5 games in which where free for me. I paid twice. and my wifes work gave us tickets at least three times. all good seats. but still concessions are horrible. Cold Beer $9 yikes. Hotdogs $5. i can get a whole of dogs for $3. Its horrible, even though i love my Cardinals. My friends and I are planning to do some minor league games this summer. Might go up to Iowa where the Cards got a farm team and Springfield,Mo where the Cards have there AA team. Across the Missouri River from St.Louis we have a Frontiere League Team called the River City Rascals. Thats fun. Its cheap, great seats and the kids love it