Star Trek Franchise

[Guest Sidewinder]

Off course I would. I'll do whatever I can to keep you informed about the event but without a question it would be very cool to meet some of you there. At least from the UK it's not that far. I was on a convention in Birmingham 2003, great experience.

Regarding "Voy"; I was a little bit disappointed that they gave up their plotline very fast. The Marquis and the federation were friends after… I don't know, perhaps seven episodes? And they had resources (Shuttles, torpedo…) nearly without restrictions.

That list could go on for a while but you get the picture. "SG: Universe" is doing better in some ways. Nevertheless "Voyager" had some great stories too. I loved species 3471, the Borg-episodes, Holo-Doc and… No, I won't mention the catsuit.

Sorry for being off topic. Somewhere inside me is an old "Star Trek" fan who hadn't the chance to talk about ST for a long time...

[ethsnafu]

Oh to hell with it, let's go completely off topic eh?

Now my take on Voyager was that the situation regarding the integration of the Marquis into the Starfleet crew was born out of necessity and considering they were flung to the other side of the galaxy without anyone but each other I could forgive that they integrated so quickly. I guess it could be explained that they were both desperate to find a way home and the quicker they pooled their talents and resources to make that happen the better.

As for Voyager's limitless supply of torpedoes I know it's stated on a number of occasions that Janeway traded technology for resources and we are shown the ramifications of this in a number of episodes so I guess it could be reasoned that that was they way they maintained a continual supply of the things they needed but let's face it, all of Trek relies on suspension of belief from the onset and Voyager really wasn't all that different from the other shows.

That said it was far from perfect. Getting rid of Kes was a mistake in my opinion and it should have been Harry Kim as originally intended and though it is often said that it became the 'Seven' show I didn't mind that at all. I thought she was a fantastic character regardless of her evident assets.

Oh and on one final point. Janeway was the best captain that franchise produced and now I'm going to run and duck the stones.

Eth

[Guest WaveCrest]

I'm not into Star Trek, but I did notice along the other guests attending FedCon 2011 Gigi Edgely, who has also starred in a very good Austrailian cop series called BlackJack.

[Guest Sidewinder]

@WaveCrest

I know Gigi Edgely only through the Australian sci-fi-series "Farscape". Very... physical part. And an underestimated show. That was really a very different kind of sci-fi.

@Eth

Janeway... the best captain... Ahm... Sorry but I don't agree. Yes, she found the right balance between mother-figure, diplomat and fighter. In that way she was a good leader. But she was simply boring even though I like Kate M., met her once, very nice lady. Sorry to say that but she is the least entertaining lead character from all the "Star Trek"-shows. I mean; yes, in real life that wouldn't matter. Within the dramatic aspects and needs of a sci-fi-show it does.

Kirk was the cool "maker", Picard the calm thinker and Sisco the man torn apart between "man of action" and diplomat. No comments on Scott Bakulas figure here. But at least James T., Jean-Luc and Benjamin were just more fun to watch. Sorry for the lack of better explanations.

Regarding "Seven of Sex" ähm, "Nine", yes, she was a great character and Jeri Ryan did a great job playing here. The writing for her was good too. But it was simply unintended funny to watch her walking through the ship in this catsuits. I mean I like seeing her body as almost every(male)one else... But that was a little bit too much, you know?

[Walkabout]

as long as everyone else is off topic....I agree as to assessment of the Captains of Star Trek franchise Sidewinder. I do think they did a good job of matching them to their series in which they played except Enterprise. Scott Bakula just didn't make the grade most of the time. Good thing he had a strong crew or the series would have been axed right away.

[Guest Sidewinder]

We should think about starting a new "Star Trek"-topic. But hey, this is fun. I havn't talked about "Star Trek" in a while. There was only a little talking about it when the JJ. Abrams-movie went into the theatres. Regarding this franchise-reboot: nothing new on a second movie with the same crew. Karl Urban just said to "Empire" magazine that getting news from JJ. is similar to getting conferred porn back from Simon Pegg; impossible.

@Walkabout

Another plus on Bakulas side; he had a cute dog.

[ethsnafu]

Consider the topic split and renamed.

The reason I prefer Janeway above all the other captains (I am excluding Archer from this discussion simply because I couldn't manage to watch Enterprise for very many episodes) is because she is the closest they got to portraying a real human being. In many ways, the character's flaws are its strength. Kirk was too much 'male bravado' for my liking, Picard was morally righteous to the point of being a trope and Sisko was more well rounded but the minute you make someone into a messiah, of sorts, the realism is abandoned but Janeway was subject to the whims and fancies most of us could identify with. The scenes of her secluded in her quarters battling depression in "Night" spoke to me far more than the constant monologues given by Picard about the moral superiority of the human race. I loved the scene of her in which she defends Star Trek protocol only after she admits she has trawled through this protocol just to check if there was a loophole she could exploit that would allow her to pick off vulnerable ships in order to save her crew. She doesn't adopt the moral high-ground willingly, she does so because sometimes she has no choice and most of the time she finds some way around it. Granted, Voyager's circumstances are very different from those of other series but I rather like characters on TV shows to be like me and I'm not perfect all the time either. It's worth noting she had a great line if whit as well which was awkward coming from Picard and delivered too self-consciously by Kirk (I waited for the *dum tish* sound every time he cracked a joke).

Eth

[Walkabout]

@Walkabout

Another plus on Bakulas side; he had a cute dog.

yes he did ! 'Tripp' would have been a better captain.

[ethsnafu]

Now I didn't follow Enterprise right to the end. I kinda gave up on it towards the end of the first season as it really wasn't doing anything for me but I read some fascinating stuff of the internet of late in which most of the main cast ended up revolting against the producer's decision to shoehorn a few characters from 'Next Generation' into the finale to boost ratings. Apparently they were so miffed that attention was taken from them in what should have been their finest hour that they began speaking out publicly against the show. Mutiny on the ship I guess.

I have to say I found the appearance of Troi and Barclay in Voyager to be a huge distraction so I understand how they felt.

Eth

[Guest Sidewinder]

Ah, I have to categorize my comments.

On "Enterprise":

Eth, you should think about giving the show a bit more time if you get the chance.

Even though the show looked very good (FX, score etc.) from the pilot on it was a very lengthy first season. The actors had to get into their roles, the audience had to fight with seeing a future where things Kirk already used do not exist. The time travel arc was a nice idea but there wasn't a significant amount of time spend on the Suliban and all that stuff in season one.

But they learned from their mistakes. Later seasons, especially the last two seasons, had continuous storylines, a lot of good references to the "later" "Star Trek", more action and a better motivated and acting crew. Not to forget some really great guest stars. Jeffrey Combs as Andorian Commander Shran was just great fun. I even remember a cool Romulan episode in the tradition of "TOS".

Don't get me wrong. "Enterprise" is probably still the least liked "Star Trek" show to me. But it got a lot better than it started.

The Captains of Star Trek

Today: Captain Kathryn Janeway

You should have given me that speech when "Voyager" went on air. Maybe you would have convinced me.

You are right in every point. I said before that I think of her as a good balanced and believable Captain. And it was well executed by Mrs. Mulgrew. Plus: her scenes with John de Lance were great all the time.

But I'm still looking for something different. A leader, a Captain, -for me- has to have a greater quality. I'm not saying he has to be larger than life- but it's not a bad thing if he is able to pretend he is. Jean-Luc Picard had that quality. Even though I sometimes was yelling at him like "Come on, tell Worf to use the phaser, damn it!" he had that well educated, reasonable, thoughtful, reserved aura but still was convincing, determined- and even vulnerable. That made him not only the most famous Earl Grey drinker but my favourite Captain.

In the end they are all "victims of their time". Kirk was the 60's "I'm capable of everything" macho (Sean Connery 007-style), Picard was the correspondent to that action-hero. Sisco was a good mixture of the both (plus: he's the only [single-]parent and a religious figure- what doesn't appealed to me). And Janeway… It was time for a woman in the chair. And she did well.