Catherine

[Guest LadyBlack]

Hello again

I'm being really greedy here, and starting two new topics! Me being a newbie too!

I am currently watching season two at the present moment, I have some tapes from season one, but not the whole series, so maybe someone can help me out here.

From what I remember, Catherine and Frank have this unspoken agreement (well, actually, it became pretty much spoken since obviously the viewers had to know about it too) with regards to Frank's work. It was all, "I know what you do, but I don't want to know" from Catherine, and to some extent, I can understand that. I just don't understand though why they got married in the first place. Presumably Frank told Catherine about his gift. Is it something he can switch on and off? Does he only receive images around cases for the FBI? Surely they will come on him regardless (Jordan's appear to, I know her gift is stronger than Frank's, but Frank must try to proect her from his FBI work as much as possible and still she has them)? It seems the best course of action, therefore, for him to work for the FBI, or in some capacity where his gift is at least going to be of assistance to people. In that case, if Catherine can't deal with Frank's work, why is she with him? Having been with him for.....well, at least a year, there must have been so many times when she blundered into his cellar to find him working on his police photos etc. and still at no point do either of them appear to have said, "This isn't really working, either the police work goes or Catherine goes".

Don't get me wrong, I loved their relationship, I was so upset (I bought the "Millennium" crossover, so I jumped from season one to season three in one abyss-yawning gap in one go) when suddenly she was dead and they'd been split up before that anyway. I don't know how much more I can take of Season two, with the whole "Daddy's living somewhere else, Jordan" story line and I found myself getting quite annoyed with Catherine, with the way she behaved when Frank rescued her. Having thought about it more, she's probably justified, but how did we get here in the first place?

Does anyone else think that things might have been better if she and Frank had never got together? Maybe if he'd married an Emma Hollis type person? Mind you, look what happened with her.....

Must just re-iterate, I thought Megan Gallagher was brilliant. One of the best moments, Catherine and Frank's scene in "Sound of Snow". Beautiful!

[Guest canadian girl]

Hey there.......you're not alone in your thinking. I wondered too sometimes why Catherine was with Frank in the first place. Like you say, she was aware of his gifts and what it could do to him.

I guess it's obvious to say that they loved each other........and they did. But were they all that compatible?

Catherine was often nasty with Frank. She was too harsh sometimes......I wanted to smack her once in a while. It was as if she were implying that he didn't care for Jordan as much as she did. I suppose that was her motherly instincts coming out. But, I still think she was too hard on Frank.

[Guest LadyBlack]

I guess it's obvious to say that they loved each other........and they did.  But were they all that compatible?

Catherine was often nasty with Frank.  She was too harsh sometimes......I wanted to smack her once in a while.  It was as if she were implying that he didn't care for Jordan as much as she did.  I suppose that was her motherly instincts coming out.  But, I still think she was too hard on Frank.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, I know the producers/writers reply is probably that they loved one another, but then surely Catherine should accept Frank's gift. I'm not saying it's Catherine's fault or anything, it just seems such a stumbling block for their marriage, I wonder why they just didn't go their separate ways.

Ooooo, I hope she never said Frank didn't care as much for Jordan as her! I liked the X-files cross-over, but it's the only bit that doesn' ring true, when Frank says he put his job before his family. I can see his work was important, and we saw more of it than his family, but...um....well, that's what the series is about! At the end of series 3, I began to really like Jordan, not simply because Brittany Tiplady manages to be a child actress without pretension, but also because Frank SMILES when he's with her. I swear, by the end of series 3 I was just praying for a moment of humour so we could get a brief twitch of the lips from Frank.

[Guest lonegungrrly1121]

At the end of series 3, I began to really like Jordan, not simply because Brittany Tiplady manages to be a child actress without pretension, but also because Frank SMILES when he's with her.  I swear, by the end of series 3 I was just praying for a moment of humour so we could get a brief twitch of the lips from Frank.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know! frank seems so happy when he's around her. some of the show's best moments are between daughter and father. plus Lance/frank looks great when he smiles

[vain68]

Take a look at the Rainer Maria Rilke thread in Heart of Darkness...particularly the later pages as they stand now...Catherine is there to allow Franks struggle be portrayed.

[Guest arcanamundi]

Does anyone else think that things might have been better if she and Frank had never got together?  Maybe if he'd married an Emma Hollis type person?  Mind you, look what happened with her..... 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There was a point in the series when I almost hoped Frank would hook up with Lara, who at least understood him better than Catherine did. But Lara was doomed too, sadly.

Poor Catherine, she did try to understand (in 'Luminary', for example), but remained, I'm afraid, a well-intentioned but clueless secular humanist. (do I sound like a Rooster? ) I confess there were times I just wanted to smack her too!

She could be so condescending at times.... remember in 'Anamnesis' when she's trying to play counselor to Claire, and the two of them are talking about a picture of the Virgin Mary at the moment Mary finds out she's going to be 'God's mother'? Catherine looks at Claire meaningfully and says softly 'She knows she's very special', but Claire replies bitterly 'She knows her life is ruined!' That moment was so cool, I thought, and summed up Catherine's limited perspective compared to Claire's (and to Frank's, and to every other character in the show that was written to have spiritual depth).

[Raven Wolf]

Lady Black. Welcome and thanks for a realy interesting topic! I agree with so much of what you've stated about their relationship that I realy have nothing to add.... eccept.... *You go girl!*

And, yes, "Luminary" seemed to be the only episode in which she was realy trying to understand and defend him. Too little, too late, I'm afraid.

[Guest LadyBlack]

Lady Black.  Welcome and thanks for a realy interesting topic!  I agree with so much of what you've stated about their relationship that I realy have nothing to add.... eccept.... *You go girl!*

And, yes, "Luminary" seemed to be the only episode in which she was realy trying to understand and defend him.  Too little, too late, I'm afraid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hello all (thanks for the greeting, Raven wolf)

I need to go watch some more episodes! I think I will be buying season one as well, and I will certainly be watching a great deal more of season two this weekend - what a treat, not having to wait a week between episodes. I need to see "Luminary" again, I was afraid I'd missed some occasions where Catherine might have defended Frank.

Vain68, please could you help me out here? I am ignorant of "Heart of Darkness" - please can you illuminate? Do you mean Catherine is there to say that Frank's work effects people who do not work within Law enforcement? That therefore although Frank must have learnt some detachment, perhaps he is not in the role he should be, and is only there because of his gift? Or is she someone to bounce off in his private life, to pinpoint his loss of control there - Frank's mental stability is something which comes to the forefront a great deal, I see it may be covered in the Virtual Season too (wow, what amazing writing there is in that!).

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

Catherine didn't know about Frank's ability at the start and just came to learn she had to accept it if she still wanted to be with Frank. This point was muddied by Season 2 which insisted on altering the exisiting explanation. Basically it runs thus:

Season 1.

Frank leads a normal life as a cop/FBI agent. This is supported by the fact that his ability is news to Bletch who knew him and catherine for a long time it seems before they moved to DC. Frank develops his gift/curse when faced with the horror of Ed Cuffle's barbarism. Catherine apparently tries to support Frank during his breakdown but cannot (ref: Dead Letters). Still, she stays with him and seems resolved to 'stand by her man' (ref: Gehenna, Powers... + Paper Doves particularly).

Season 2.

Hmm. Unwisely, the writers now choose to say that Frank has always had this gift and knew about it too having had a mother who displayed similar traits ('The Curse of Frank Black' and particularly 'Midnight of the Century'. This smashes the above assumptions from S1 to high heaven.

Season 3.

Largely it seems, the writers choose to ignore the 'revelations' of the last Season and re-establish Frank's gift as manifesting in the Ed Cuffle case (ref: Via Dolorosa/Goodbye to all That).

Catherine and Frank's relationship is awkwardly handled from Season to Season - in particular, Catherine's reason for leaving Frank is not the reason she cites in any other episode! She leaves him because she is worried over what is happening to him, that he lost sight of who he was just to rescue her. That to me seemed like she considered herself to be a threat to Frank's sanity, that if she stayed it would only get worse. Later she rips into Frank like everything is his fault for his association with MLM Group (who had't done a thing to earn her ire as of TBATE!)

[vain68]

Vain68, please could you help me out here? I am ignorant of "Heart of Darkness" - please can you illuminate? Do you mean Catherine is there to say that Frank's work effects people who do not work within Law enforcement? That therefore although Frank must have learnt some detachment, perhaps he is not in the role he should be, and is only there because of his gift? Or is she someone to bounce off in his private life, to pinpoint his loss of control there - Frank's mental stability is something which comes to the forefront a great deal, I see it may be covered in the Virtual Season too (wow, what amazing writing there is in that!).

I just meant that you should read my thoughts in that section (Heart of Darkness) of the board...I talk there about my thoughts on Catherine and her role in the series...I hope this helps, or did you mean that you read what I wrote there and are asking for an elaboration on that?

Vv