A Room With No View

[Raven Wolf]

Terry & I had a 6 episode Milllennium-a-thon last night, which ended with "A Room With No View". Now, he's seeing these for the first time, and it's great to hear a fresh perspective, and see what he gets out of it.

His first observation with this one was that the phrase "A room with no view" means to be locked inside one's own mind. I, being interested in psycholigy, was thrilled to find this out, as it adds to the meaning in this episode. This almost seemed like a "Jonah and the whale" story, meant to strengthen this boy's caracter. We've all had times like this. Times of tribulation, just like Frank was having throughout the series.

What does everyone think about this? Did you see the same symbolisum in this? Did it have any personal effct on you?

I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts....

Raven~

[vain68]

This was perhaps one of the top five episodes of the entire series in terms of psychology and character development. Raven, when I get a little time, I'll give you further perspective on this episode.

V

[Guest chrisnu]

I agree that the episode's title illustrates a great deal of what the episode is about. The idea of how getting away from the routine of everything that's familiar can be an experience of personal growth. I certainly think that Landon had changed for the better because of his experiences, traumatic as they were, they made him think, a bit of a call to arms.

[Raven Wolf]

This was perhaps one of the top five episodes of the entire series in terms of psychology and character development. Raven, when I get a little time, I'll give you further perspective on this episode.

V

Thanks. Looking forward to it!

I agree that the episode's title illustrates a great deal of what the episode is about. The idea of how getting away from the routine of everything that's familiar can be an experience of personal growth. I certainly think that Landon had changed for the better because of his experiences, traumatic as they were, they made him think, a bit of a call to arms.

Thank you! I agree. It was kinda like another version of Luminary, don't you think?

[Guest chrisnu]

Thank you! I agree. It was kinda like another version of Luminary, don't you think?

Yes, in that despite the trauma of the events, physical and otherwise, both Alex and Landon gained knowledge through their experience, the illuminating of intangible things.

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

I must say that I don't particularly share people's postive appraisal here. I found this to be a very downbeat episode indeed. It did mark Landon as someone who stands out, someone who like the members of the Millennium Group will not be beat down. However, its judgement on the ruck and run of humanity was reminiscent of the yokels from 'Beware of the Dog'.

Landon tries his best to escape; he does what he can to nurture and help his fellow captive but what does this avail him? His attempts to escape meet with repeated failure. When he has a real chance to get free, the boy he was trying to save turns around and betrays him. The future careers teacher at his school is systematically breaking the kids down and crushing their dreams and what of the other kids in the lair? Some refuse to leave at first and are just sitting paralysed indicating a possbility that the damage is already done.

This episode reminds me very much of '1984' and the unfortunate message that deep down, we want peace however we can get it. If we have to sell people out, our friends even, we'll do it if it means avoiding pain and despair. 'It is such a wonderful trait of the ordinary' says Lucy. She indicates that names and relationships are ultimately meaningless because we don't really care about them, just about our own comfort and pleasure. If it ceases to be profitable, we'll happily turn our backs.

Like most of the rest of Season 2, the episode shows humanity to be generally selfish, cowardly and weak; that it takes extraordinary people like Frank, Peter, Landon etc to make the difference. Landon, in returning to his father is adhering to Lucy's rules. He is leaving any ambition, any chance of a good life with his mother, going back to his average grades and the promise of nothing more than an ordinary existence. He is someone great who is choosing to be average and that is the crux of what Lucy wants.

Frank on the other hand is not afforded the chance to cast off his greatness and his future tasks and trials. Crucially though he tries to in this episode - he keeps calling Jordan again and again but fate has more in store for Frank Black. He wants to go back to seeing his daughter every day, to not having to live apart from her, to just be ordinary like Catherine wants him to. Lucy has made her point: to be ordinary is to be happy, for the great to be ordinary surely merits a wondrous reward - protection for Jordan and Catherine perhaps? If Jordan has answered the phone then it could have been all over in this moment of Frank's weakness. Lucy would have won.

Do you really see that as an upbeat ending? I don't.

[Raven Wolf]

Yes, in that despite the trauma of the events, physical and otherwise, both Alex and Landon gained knowledge through their experience, the illuminating of intangible things.

Yes. That's what I was thinking, too.

Do you really see that as an upbeat ending? I don't.

I never said it was as upbeat an ending as Luminary..... It's almost like a mirror image of Luminary. What I saw in "Room" was a reflection of what society is trying to do to its children............Slowly beating them down.

[Guest A Stranger]

I don't understand MDM, you're take on Landon returning to his Father as him adhering to Lucy. His father tells Frank that living with him is the difficult choice, that it would have been easy for him to live wiht his mother. I never got the impression from veiwing that Landon had done what Lucy wanted. I just saw it as bringing closure to that story. I didn't make the connections either of Frank and his desire for the ordianry life with his calls to Jordan. Not to say it's not meant, but I just saw that as having to do with the theme of children and the fact that Jordan hadn't even been seen, let alone mentioned in a while! That could be what was intended, seeing as how Frank have very little to do with the story as it is.

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

Peter says something like 'I can't imagine not seeing my daughter everyday'. Frank is in that situation - his work is estranging him from his family. He calls when he can but it isn't enough because he keeps missing Jordan. The people in 'A Room...' have had their children taken away and Lucy has become a surrogate parent for them teaching them her values in the absence of their parents. Frank is faced with the problem of continuing with his work and risking further detachment from Jordan and not being there to teach her as he grows. Like Landon's dad needs his son, Frank needs his daughter as we have learned in so many episodes. Lucy is attacking Frank through his daughter - she doesn't need to be there at the end as her point is already proved to him.

This episode, like 'In Arcadia Ego' shows Frank's continuing distance from the Millennium Group. Whenever Peter wants to talk about the case at the start, Frank talks of his daughter. When Peter speaks of Jordan, Frank talks of work. They are no longer on the same wavelength and it wouldn't take much at this point to jolt Frank back to his family life which is where he wants to be.

As to Landon... he is choosing a harder road by living with his father yes. But consider what Lucy was asking him to do. She never asked him to choose the easy life, she actually told him that he must choose struggle - the struggle to go from being great and full of promise to simply being ordinary. Landon has a great mind and a life with his mother would be a springboard for better things. Instead, Landon suffers by staying with a father he loves. He sacrifices his future and all he could be to live a normal life supporting his father. If Frank returned to Catherine and Jordan, it would be exactly the same. They need him like Landon's Dad needs his son. But Frank cannot return to them because of the call of duty.

This duty is eroded by this episode. At the end I truly believe Frank would have quit the Group and gone back to his family if he could just have spoken to Jordan for a few minutes.

I think this episode only has as much connection with 'Luminary' as every other episode of this season. Certainly there is the theme of 'choosing what makes you happy' again but it is tainted with the problem of whether such a choice is at the expense of those who are suffering.

[Guest Jim McLean]

Peter says something like 'I can't imagine not seeing my daughter everyday'. Frank is in that situation - his work is estranging him from his family. He calls when he can but it isn't enough because he keeps missing Jordan. The people in 'A Room...' have had their children taken away and Lucy has become a surrogate parent for them teaching them her values in the absence of their parents. Frank is faced with the problem of continuing with his work and risking further detachment from Jordan and not being there to teach her as he grows. Like Landon's dad needs his son, Frank needs his daughter as we have learned in so many episodes. Lucy is attacking Frank through his daughter - she doesn't need to be there at the end as her point is already proved to him.

This episode, like 'In Arcadia Ego' shows Frank's continuing distance from the Millennium Group. Whenever Peter wants to talk about the case at the start, Frank talks of his daughter. When Peter speaks of Jordan, Frank talks of work. They are no longer on the same wavelength and it wouldn't take much at this point to jolt Frank back to his family life which is where he wants to be.

As to Landon... he is choosing a harder road by living with his father yes. But consider what Lucy was asking him to do. She never asked him to choose the easy life, she actually told him that he must choose struggle - the struggle to go from being great and full of promise to simply being ordinary. Landon has a great mind and a life with his mother would be a springboard for better things. Instead, Landon suffers by staying with a father he loves. He sacrifices his future and all he could be to live a normal life supporting his father. If Frank returned to Catherine and Jordan, it would be exactly the same. They need him like Landon's Dad needs his son. But Frank cannot return to them because of the call of duty.

This duty is eroded by this episode. At the end I truly believe Frank would have quit the Group and gone back to his family if he could just have spoken to Jordan for a few minutes.

I think this episode only has as much connection with 'Luminary' as every other episode of this season. Certainly there is the theme of 'choosing what makes you happy' again but it is tainted with the problem of whether such a choice is at the expense of those who are suffering.

You pose a fascinating argument there, but it doesn't quite sync with what I see in the episode. I think one has to be careful about springing ties which IMO aren't apparent.

I agree with you that there is a question of duty in this season; Franks need to protect his family distances himself from the simple life of living with them, and I think that is a positive role - and I agree, what keeps him from being "ordinary" is the thread that Lucy is there to subjugate.

However, your interpretation of the ending I feel I'm at odds with. I don't see Landon's embrace with his father indicative that he's taken Lucy's message and embracing normalcy in the way than Frank can't, as indicative that he has become normal while Frank remains "special". Landon's choice to be with his Father's was his own - and it was always for love. His father states Landon knew that his Father couldn't live without him, so his reaction on his return retains that same ideology - it shows no indication that it's changed.

I also don't agree that Frank would have given up his role with Millennium if he'd spoken to Jordan, nor do I believe fate was keeping him away from that prospect. It's an interesting theory, but I don't see evidence in the narrative to support it. Incidentally, I've always wondered how much of an answer "Siren" gave Frank, as his move back towards the Millennium group seems to follow that exploration into "normal life". Depending on whether you see those visions as being a reason for his belief in retaining Millennium connections does affect how you perceive the outcome. If you believe the Sirens vision gave him an understanding as to his role in fighting the evil protects his daughter, then he would not be on the edge of going back to her - he'd know that isn't the way to protect her and his role in Millennium has always been about protecting his family.

So no, I don't see Frank's call to Jordan being a test of his strength, merely a reminder of how being special isn't easy; that the sacrifices we do make - which isn't far from some of the lines of thought you were suggesting.

With Landon, I would probably agree with you its not an up beat ending, but not for the same reasons. I don't believe he was beaten by Lucy - I don't think she had the time to break him, but I do feel the episode suggests she would break him eventually; that he had no more strength than the others in the long run. The final scene between him and her showed no evidence he was holding up. He was merely fortunate to be released.

The final scenes to me - the juxtaposition of Landon to Frank was to show what Frank didn't have; that his special role prevented him from having, no matter how much he wanted it. I don't think Landon's role has been established, and I don't think the episode ends with any evidence that he hasn't been broken to complete what brilliance he may have achieved. It may have made him stronger, or it may have made him weaker. I think there is an ambiguity there. The only certainty is Frank's role has given back another father his child - something he knows he can't do for himself.

If we consider Jesus, we have a man who comes from humble beginnings to bestow brilliance on the world. I think that's the simple message of this episode; that Evil needs to suppress and destroy that natural spark and create sheep that stick to the rules of an unfair system; that Evil has continued throughout the ages to prevent such sparks of natural, honest spirit from occurring whenever it can and Lucy was their to abuse and brainwash those people until they no longer had identity beyond the one that she gave them.

A very downbeat episode in many ways. The ending is upbeat only so far as this incident is stopped and the people are released. Beyond that, everything suggested in this story is quite brutal - dramatically and ideologically. To be special is a threat to Evil - and that's pretty much the vibe Frank's being getting throughout the season, his big question is whether Millennium itself is working for or against that evil.