The Mythology?!?! Well it's... good?

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

I recently went through and watched 'The X-Files' again, taking a slightly different approach. I have always been primarily a stand alone episodes fan, and have been rather critical of the mytharc over the years, so I decided to go through only watching the mythology episodes. I included some stand alones that had truly significant events (like 'Sleepless' where we first see Mr X for example).

I was pleasantly surprised with how much I enjoyed it. I still think it twisted and turned into itself into too many knots over the years, but they always seemed to be able to raise it up every couple of seasons. One thing that struck me anew was the puzzling insistence on Chris Carter and Frank Spotnitz to write together.

Let me just say that I actually don't mind Frank Spotnitz that much these days. He writes fun, adventerous X-Files for the most part, and is at his best when doing an 'action spectacular'. He proves early on to be a very effective 'finisher' as he solo writes the second part of both 'Colony/End Game' and 'Nisei/731'. In both cases, the first episode is twisty and muddled on occasion, but lays the groundwork so Spotnitz can cut lose and break out the guns, howitzers, alien bounty hunters etc. If they had continued like this, they might have enjoyed great sucess.

Because early on, Chris Carter has a bit of a problem with action. His episodes are very talky, full of interesting ideas, but low on prolonged thrills and spills. They ooze atmosphere of course, but lack that adrenalin, full throttle feel that everyone needs after a lengthy investigation episode. After all, there are only so many creepy discoveries and labyrinthine monologues that we can take.

I think Carter falls into the trap over the years, of making it all complicated for its own sake. The episodes will often twist and turn so much that you frankly have to own it on video or DVD or you stand no chance of understanding what the hell just happened, to who and why. I also intensely disliked the above mentioned monlogues of Carter - they always sound so pompous and don't sound anything like what the characters would actually say (Memento Mori, Redux, etc have example of this).

But its that collaboration with Spotnitz that does it for me. When writing with others (David Duchovny, Howard Gordon etc), the episodes are complex, but are built on decent foundations at least most of the time. Carter and Spotnitz episodes tend to be rather silly at times, and veer off in directions that are eventually abandoned (the russian arms race for a vaccine is soon forgotten about, beyond a quick season 5 revisit, and the events of the film, with the aliens springing from the black oil doesn't survive long).

That's not to say Carter writes flawless episodes on his own all the time, but episodes like Piper Maru, Nothing Important Happened Today, Tunguska etc seem to have been written with the 'wouldn't that look cool - let's make a story around it' kind of forumula (Spotnitz admits in the documentaries that this is how he writes). That's okay if it's just a flashy special effects fight, or explosion, but when it's ideas for a whole mythlogy episode around one image, things get rather strained.

The only truly sucessful collaboration they did (i.e when it is just them and no others) was 'Two Fathers/One Son'. That may have been derived from a 'wouldn't it be cool?' (in this case, wiping out the Syndicate), but they managed to capture the feel that the invasion really was going to happen.

It occurs to me that my attitude to Seasons 8 and 9 and their difference (I loved both seasons) may seem to be at odds with my strong views on the changes to Millennium in its second season. In my defence on this, I think Carter and co knew around season 6 that they weren't going to get much more out of Duchnovny (his 'can't be bothered' attitude is very distracting in Season 7), and planned accordingly.

I think a certain amount of leeway must be afforded in this case, because they didn't know how long the leads would stay, whether or not they would be renewed etc etc. I can say that when he knew what the season Eight situation was, I think Chris Carter returned to form in a magnificent way.

And again, it's the episodes with Spotnitz mid-season when Mulder returns, that really let the side down. His solo episodes 'Within/Without and Essence/Existence' were excellent I thought. Indeed, I think if they could have persuaded Duchovny to stay on, the cast is meshing very well at the end of 8. It's unfortunate then that they have to rejig again in S9, and I think the mythlogy episodes of 9 are really quite awful (I don't mind the Super Soliders thing - although a better name for them wouldn't have hurt), but all credibility is lost after the dreadful 'magnetic Quinn' incident of 'Trust NO1'.

I don't think it's any coincidence that the increase in collaborations (they co-wrote all the S9 mythology episodes except 'The Truth') comes as the episodes plummet in quality. But after so many unforunate episodes (Tunguska/Terma, 'Patient X/The Red and the Black) for example, why didn't they stop to re-evaluate?

Because although Carter does write some bad mythology episodes, all the truly great episodes are either solo works or with David Duchovny (The Erlynmeyer Flask, Anasazi, Paper Clip, Sixth Extinction 2, Within, Without, Essence, Existence). His work with Spotnitz produced only blind alleys that he had to negotiate his way out of, and led to them fluffing their greatest opportunity - the bland, impossibly wordy, recap heavy and spectacle free film 'Fight the Future'.

I'm big enough to admit that I was wrong about the mythlogy, and that there is plenty to admire. But the avenues they explore from late Season 3 through seasons 4-5 are poor, and led I remember vividly, to the show's practically overnight collapse in Britain, although it went on with a strong following for many more years in America.

But I do think people are very unfair on Season 8's mythlogy episodes. The only real clunkers are 'Per Manum' and 'Deadalive'. The others are all pretty good in my opinion (plus I just like Doggett and Reyes better than Mulder and Scully - I know, I know, sacrilege... but that's how I feel).

Anyway, I just thought I should come clean and own up to actually enjoying the mythlogy after years of trashing it! (And no, the same will not be happening about Millennium Season 2!!!) :D

[Guest Laurent.]

Nice to see someone who's actually able to change his mind... pretty good interpretation of the mythology. But I'll have to defend the Chris Carter's monologues; they're not suppose to be something that the character would say but only texts and poems that are able to reflects the inner thoughts and feelings of the character. With that in mind, I think they were pretty cool and added a certain level of beauty to some episodes (the intro to Memento Mori was beautiful... I dare anyone to contest me on that).

[liberty]

I wouldn't know. As I have stated previously on some other post, I think that from season 3 onwards the whole smear became a sad joke. Now don't get all pumped up MDM. As soon as I'll have the courage to watch the remaining series I will get back to you.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

This could be interesting, MDM, considering how much we are on the same page regarding MM S2.

I still think it twisted and turned into itself into too many knots over the years, but they always seemed to be able to raise it up every couple of seasons.

I think the mythology of TXF is all too often dismissed by some as confusing and muddled. IMO, if you take the time to really think about it and study it, it holds up pretty darn well over 9 seasons. Granted, it's not absolutely perfect, it's not completely free of holes or lose ends, but all things considered it's still pretty solid. IMO, it's far far more cohesive and logical over 9 full years than the current darling Lost has managed to be in just 3.

Let me just say that I actually don't mind Frank Spotnitz that much these days. He writes fun, adventerous X-Files for the most part, and is at his best when doing an 'action spectacular'. He proves early on to be a very effective 'finisher' as he solo writes the second part of both 'Colony/End Game' and 'Nisei/731'.

At the risk of telling you something you might already know, it's interesting to note that "731" was actually conceived as a story first, as a single episode, but was later expanded and added "Nisei" into it. When you then go and watch it again, you can kind of tell.

Because early on, Chris Carter has a bit of a problem with action. His episodes are very talky, full of interesting ideas, but low on prolonged thrills and spills. They ooze atmosphere of course, but lack that adrenalin, full throttle feel that everyone needs after a lengthy investigation episode.

I would hold up "The Erlenmeyer Flask" and "Duane Barry" as examples of early solo episodes that very much contradict that assertion.

I also intensely disliked the above mentioned monlogues of Carter - they always sound so pompous and don't sound anything like what the characters would actually say (Memento Mori, Redux, etc have example of this).

I'm with laran on this one. I think the Carter monologues (or "Carterlogues") add something a bit special and are usually very successful. I would also echo what laran said in that they are (usually) not intended to represent what a character would actually say, they're more about either inner thought or else pure concept that is not meant to be from even the mind of the character, despite being voiced by one of them. There are times when they do represent specific thought (e.g. "Memento Mori" and "Essence") but others when I would argue they are merely prologues that don't belong to any individual character, despite whose voice we hear (e.g. "Patient X", "Biogenesis").

I think these are an excellent part of the series, and make it something a bit more lyrical and a bit more artistic than some of the bland and soulless stuff out there (e.g. CSI).

I think Carter usually pulls these off best. On the contrary, it is when he is not involved that they come across more maudlin and silly (e.g. M&W's nonsensical quoting of Robert Browning in "The Field Where I Died", or Spotnitz/Gilligan/Shiban in "Emily").

But its that collaboration with Spotnitz that does it for me. When writing with others (David Duchovny, Howard Gordon etc), the episodes are complex, but are built on decent foundations at least most of the time. Carter and Spotnitz episodes tend to be rather silly at times, and veer off in directions that are eventually abandoned (the russian arms race for a vaccine is soon forgotten about, beyond a quick season 5 revisit, and the events of the film, with the aliens springing from the black oil doesn't survive long).

Hmm, sometimes this may be the case, but I think there an equal amount of times where they do a great job (e.g. "Piper Maru"/"Apocrypha", "Tempus Fugit"/"Max", "Patient X"/"The Red and the Black", "Two Fathers"/"One Son", "This is Not Happening"). In other words, hits and misses, just like anybody, not enough to assert a continuing trend.

That's not to say Carter writes flawless episodes on his own all the time, but episodes like Piper Maru, Nothing Important Happened Today, Tunguska etc seem to have been written with the 'wouldn't that look cool - let's make a story around it' kind of forumula (Spotnitz admits in the documentaries that this is how he writes). That's okay if it's just a flashy special effects fight, or explosion, but when it's ideas for a whole mythlogy episode around one image, things get rather strained.

I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say here. Are you saying that Carter writes better with or without Spotnitz?

And again, it's the episodes with Spotnitz mid-season when Mulder returns, that really let the side down. His solo episodes 'Within/Without and Essence/Existence' were excellent I thought.

I agree that "Within", "Without", "Essence" and "Existence" were all first rate and truly excellent. However, I also think that "Per Manum", "This is Not Happening" and "Three Words" (all CC&FS collaborations) were also very good. I'd say it's only "DeadAlive" that slightly lets the side down, as you put it.

Indeed, I think if they could have persuaded Duchovny to stay on, the cast is meshing very well at the end of 8.

I don't know if that would have been a good idea. IMO, his absence from much of S8 reinvigorated the show, and necessity was the mother of invention in bringing in John Doggett/Robert Patrick and returning to some darker and more intense stories.

I think the mythlogy episodes of 9 are really quite awful

I don't agree. I think "Nothing Important Happened Today", "Nothing Important Happened Today II", "Trust No 1", "Provenance", "Providence", "William" and "The Truth" all do a pretty good job. Most if not all of them are more entertaining, for me, than the likes of "Sen und Zeit"/"Closure", "The Beginning", "Christmas Carol"/"Emily", and "Tunguska"/"Terma".

I don't think it's any coincidence that the increase in collaborations (they co-wrote all the S9 mythology episodes except 'The Truth') comes as the episodes plummet in quality. But after so many unforunate episodes (Tunguska/Terma, 'Patient X/The Red and the Black) for example, why didn't they stop to re-evaluate?

Well, first of all I don't think they (or I) would agree with your assessment of those episodes being unsuccessful. It's also worth noting that Chris Carter only signed on to return to S9 at the very last minute, and was feeling it was time to come to an end. Spotnitz was thus a little more involved in running the ship, as it were, than he had been previously.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

His work with Spotnitz produced only blind alleys that he had to negotiate his way out of, and led to them fluffing their greatest opportunity - the bland, impossibly wordy, recap heavy and spectacle free film 'Fight the Future'.

Whoa, very surprised to hear that. I found the movie to be a brilliant success. I think it straddles the line between hand-holding new audiences and being true to existing audiences admirably, captures the spirit of the show superbly, and also ups the ante to a feature film scale with more than it's fair share of spectacle (the opening explosion in Dallas? The helicopter chase through the corn fields? The giant antarctic station and subsequent spaceship take-off?

Again, it's not flawless. I think the main problem is that, after the car-bomb that kills the Well-Manicured Man, there is too much of a long stretch without any dialogue. Besides that though, I think the movie was a great event and delivered on the vast majority of my expectations.

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

Well first of all, I do realise that the monologues are not supposed to be considered as something actually said. But I consider them to be almost universally poor, I'm afraid. They are execessivly wordy, dealing in huge unwieldy sentences, that lack any sort of life to them. It's Carter's curse really, as though he produces some excellent ideas and genuinely thought provoking stories, he often falls into the trap of having his characters reel out lines after line of recaps/musings on the universe.

Scully is often a victim of this, as the rooftop scene at the start of the X-Files film shows. This kind of lengthy monlogue is just not suited to the film medium. Conversations like that with the WMM are little more than recaps that reveal nothing that Mulder doesn't already know really. It is purely for the new viewer, and Carter does this in his episodes on a regular basis. Characters will just stop what they are doing and say something like 'Hey it's (X); you remember him? He contacted you to (insert lengthy recap delivered chapter and verse)?'

I suggested that Spotnitz works well as a 'second episode' writer. In the early going, Carter is unable to deliver sustained action set pieces, as his interests lie elsewhere. You quoted 'Duane Barry', but that is an extremely talky, actionless episode. I'm not saying it isn't a great episode (it's one of my favourites), but criticism of this episode usually focuses on the lack of action (this is easy enough to check, just browse around the internet a bit).

Spotnitz meanwhile delivers fine, actiony popcorn munchers in the first few seasons. His influence and savvy about good action definately rubs off on Carter, but it takes a long, long time for the results to really start surfacing in solo Carter work (ironically, it is in S6 - just after the very spectacle free film - that he starts to implement action well!) He steadily improves this over the seasons, but retreats many times to the safety of what he knows (i.e religious/philosophical musing, twisting conspiracy etc). So we get a lot of episodes like 'Sixth Extinction' before he feels confident enough to ask for the keys to the gun cabinet in Season 8.

I must disagree very strongly about many of the collaborative episodes you cited. 'Piper Maru' and especially 'Apocrypha' are fondly remembered because of the debut of the black oil. But much of it stretches beyond what is acceptable even for a limits of possiblility show (the WW2 pilot who has survived without air, food, water etc). Images like this might be good for a quick scare, but they a headache in the explanation as even the most ready fans have conceded that this is a step too far (the body needs nourishment and just saying the alien takes care of everything is an appalling cheat - Carter provoked a similiar outburst with his story of 'reverse aging' in S1's 'Young at Heart'.

Of course, if it was just that I could forgive it. I try not to delve too deeply into science that doesn't actually exist after all. But sometimes, it is simply too intrusive. Besides this though, PM/AP was a very slight tale - you can usually tell these when by the end, nothing has been achieved. They go to the silo, and get arrested again - briefly. So it's another round of them being arrested and let go by the Syndicate for spurious reasons, Krychek 'dead' but not dead, characters in and out of the hospital so much they should apply for permanent residence... It was treading water, despite its sometimes engaging images. I realise that with the submarine being called the ZeusFaber though, you have a vested interest! :D

I consider 'Patient X/ The Red and the Black' to be one of the very worst mythlogy two parters. I can't be doing with S5 at the best of times as it heralds the arrival of many 'rogue' elements (I am not a huge fan of the rather silly alien rebels, Gibson Praise, Diana Fowley, Agent Spender etc etc). Mulder's lack of engagement with both the case and the season in general (something that most of the writers actually gloss over, or else write 'alternative' or comedic episodes to circumvent), and Chris Carter's very suspect directing in TRATB contribute to an experience that is absolutely torturous (he nailed it first time with 'Duane Barry', but rarely matched that directorial success again).

I just find episodes written by Spotnitz and Carter (and this includes the film) to bring out very poor results. Most proceed from shaky foundations, as Spotnitz simply doesn't come up with ideas that are good as Carters. We gets swarms of bees carrying alien virus (which is just a preposterous turn, which is wisely phased out after the film). We get Xena Warrior Princess drowning people in the nude, Mulder actually being buried for several months (which after a slight bout of PTSD - and by that I mean a few seconds of it - he cheerfully forgets), all manner of silliness. And as for 'Tempus Fugit/Max' - why? It's just 'Fallen Angel' stretched out and not as good. The only decent ideas (like Mulder's similarity to Max) were already covered in FA. It's just another pointless investigation that leads nowhere.

And about those Season 9 episodes... well each to their own, and trust me, you'd have to go a long way to find a bigger fan of Season 9 than me, but I really thought these were a big let down. Trust No1 is one of the worst episodes I've ever seen. Words just can't describe how bad it is. It doesn't help that the whole season proceeds from a bad plot point - if the Super Soldiers wanted Mulder dead, why didn't they just kill him/capture him as they drove away from the birth at the end of Season 8? Did they get to the end of the road and decide 'Damn, you know we really should have dealt with him when he was right outside our cars, when they were about 15 of us at least and one of him with no weapons that mattered'. Remember that S9 starts only the following day!

I realise that they try and say Kersh made him go, but it's so thin. Like I said, he has very good reason to suppose that the Super soldiers will not come bothering him, scully or the baby (because they had every chance to do so at the birth and didn't). Then we get a season of 'The Miracle Baby'... just no (I can't stand 'Per Manum' at all either, whilst we're on the subject). The UFO cult thing was about the only thing I found somewhat interesting, but it was marred by yet another trip to the hospital ward (the season has 3 seperate instances where either Doggett or Reyes are at death's door). To make matters worse, one of them comes right after 'Providence'!

It probably sounds like I don't like any of the Mythology, but remember that there are a great many of them, and most of the ones I haven't mentioned thus far are frequently excellent. I just think Seasons 4-5 dropped the ball horrendously with regard to the mythlogy. I don't really like any of the mythology episodes from this season (and I hestitate to say it because of further risk of me being seen as a curmudgeon of the first water, but I despise 'Memento Mori' and the whole cancer angle - particularly the ludicrous cancer eating monster of the week they use to reveal it...)

But I must reiterate that I find Carter to be a very talented writer by and large. Some missteps are inevitable when you write so many episodes. And let's be fair to Carter; he was widely and constantly criticised for his stand alone episodes, which admittedly often leave something to be desired. But he was big enough to cut back on them; he listened to the critcisms and decided to focus his efforts on the places where he felt he could contribute best to the show.

But at the same time, he never gave up trying and kept working at it, trying to find a forumula that worked for him on the standalones. Instead of writing lots of them, he cut back to just one or two a season, tried directing them himself to more properly articulate what he was talking about, thought carefully about what actors would best do justice to his ideas. It didn't always pay off (he directs the terrible S3 episode 'The List' for example), but in S5 he finally hit upon something that did work.

I have often criticised 'The Post Modern Prometheus', but I was wrong about that episode too. I still have some reservations about the subject matter, but I can't really deny the visual imagination behind it all. It's so good to see a different side of Carter that we uaually don't get to see (i.e someone who whilst suspicious of authority and pessimistic about modern society, yearns for a life in which people are just better and more decent to each other).

So in a bold move, Carter decides to stick to the mythology primarily and use his standalones as experiments. It takes a great deal of courage to move beyond your comfort zone, and try new things, not least because it is placing an enormus amount of faith in your fellow writers. He is basically saying 'Look, I'm going to try this, which may or may not work - hold down the fort while I do it'. But that was always his style, and is the thing that constantly lifts his work and his shows out of the many shows that are merely good.

He takes big ideas, grand concepts and and demands people consider them, because he respects us and our intelligence enough to know that if the work is good enough, we will want it, regardless of what common wisdom about how to make sucessful shows might be. He falls flat on his face many times, but he always picked himself up and gave it another swing - WITHOUT ENDANGERING THE SHOW TO DO IT.

I'm ashamed of the way I've disregarded the mythylogy over the years, because it feels like I wasn't giving the same respect back. That doesn't mean I blindly accept everything he has done as genius (and I'm not suggesting anyone else is either). I do think that Carter and Spotnitz were a poor partnership, and I would have liked Carter to take sole control of some of the more important episodes ('Closure', 'Deadalive' and hey why not - 'Millennium' (the episode, not the series).

He seemed to be a writer who thrived on energy and momentum. That is why I think DD's departure was so unfortunate. The X-Files regained its momentum in S6 after the film, lost it briefly in S7 (although I like much of S7, DD is clearly at the end of his rope with the schedule and it all looks so murky and horrible), then gained it right back again in 8. 'Within/Without' is so clean and simple in its execution. No melding together of places we haven't yet seen and side plots that wind up being A plots, just great character work and thrilling action.

It's also refreshing to see Carter abandon the 'but we can't do that - the canon states...' Like I said, the science is actually real. It shouldn't come in the way of the story and the flow of the action, if that is the only reason. So Scully didn't use a stiletto and guns shouldn't technically work based on the earlier episodes. Big deal I say. The episode flowed better when she was able to kill the bounty hunter, giving a sense of closure and empowerment to her (because 'Within' is designed to empower Doggett. 'Without' transfers that to Scully).

There are many disagreements here, but many agreements also I feel. If I have made people like Liberty uncomfortable, then please accept my apologies. The thread on Millennium was supposed to root out the episodes that made us really mad after all! I care deeply about Millennium, and I don't mind saying so. But I just want good, informed discussion like anyone else at the end of the day. If someone makes a good point, I like to think I respect their opinions.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

Well first of all, I do realise that the monologues are not supposed to be considered as something actually said. But I consider them to be almost universally poor, I'm afraid. They are execessivly wordy, dealing in huge unwieldy sentences, that lack any sort of life to them.

We'll have to just disagree on this point. I find them to show an artistic command of the language that is so much more interesting than the dry prose of most other TV. If I only wanted dialogue that was 100% naturalistic and only used the range of language that everyday people use, I'd tune in to a Reality TV show. Take Shakespeare -- people don't really talk in the way his most famous and oft-quoted soliloquys sound, not even back in his age, but they're still regard as literary and theatrical masterpieces. Now, I'm not trying to compare Chris Carter to Shakespeare, of course not, but the principal is the same.

Scully is often a victim of this, as the rooftop scene at the start of the X-Files film shows. This kind of lengthy monlogue is just not suited to the film medium. Conversations like that with the WMM are little more than recaps that reveal nothing that Mulder doesn't already know really. It is purely for the new viewer,

It is purely for the new viewer, yes, but that was something that the movie just had to do in order to work. For existing fans it can sound wrong, but it was essential to making the movie work for a mainstream audience that had never watched a single episode in the past. I don't think he can be criticsied for that in the least.

In the early going, Carter is unable to deliver sustained action set pieces, as his interests lie elsewhere. You quoted 'Duane Barry', but that is an extremely talky, actionless episode.

I guess it depends what you call action then. What about all the alien torture scenes shot with strobe lighting effects? Actionless? This was the kind of sequence the series had never attempted so far, and just blew me away. And what about the whole hostage scenario? Is that not filled with tension? A shootout to resolve it to satisfy those who equate violence with bullets and only bullets. Then Duane Barry's escape from the hospital and subsequent abduction of Scully. That's not talky and actionless in my book.

What about "The Erlenmeyer Flask"? It opens with a massive sequence with a car chase and police shootout complete with tazers, batons, fists an bullets, ending with a man plummeting into the water. Actionless? Then there the bad guys and their gas masks executing the "hybrid", plus the exchange on the bridge ending in Deep Throat's shooting and death scene. How much more action does there need to be?

How about "The Host"? All those sequences in the sewers? The scene with the toothpaste and the guy in the shower where the tape worm comes out -- there's not a single bit of dialogue in all that, so it's anything but talky!

You say CC didn't pull off action well until S6. Well to that I give you "Anasazi", "Paper Clip", "Herrenvolk", "Redux II", and "The End". All packed full of action in my book.

'Piper Maru' and especially 'Apocrypha' are fondly remembered because of the debut of the black oil. But much of it stretches beyond what is acceptable even for a limits of possiblility show (the WW2 pilot who has survived without air, food, water etc). Images like this might be good for a quick scare, but they a headache in the explanation as even the most ready fans have conceded that this is a step too far (the body needs nourishment and just saying the alien takes care of everything is an appalling cheat

I disagree. The very point of this sequence is that a human could never have survived under these conditions, that's what makes it shocking and scary. I would argue that the body probably is dead, having had no nourishment or air, but the point is that it is the alien within it doing all the controlling and movement. Once it left the body, I imagine it was left as a corpse.

Besides this though, PM/AP was a very slight tale - you can usually tell these when by the end, nothing has been achieved.

I hardly think so. The two-parter had a strong emotional theme underpinning the whole thing, the idea of death, explored through Scully's anger that the investigation into her sister's murder has been dropped. That's one thing. Beyond that, it also has a twisting conspiracy plot that brings us back to the threads left at the end of "Paper Clip", with Krycek returning along with the MJ documents. To top that, Skinner is shot to provide your requisite action (alongside a car chase a big shootout with Uzis and all).

And as for things being achieved by the end? Well, Scully's sister's killer is unmasked, tracked down, arrested and killed, resolving a fairly major storyline, plus the MJ files are returned to the possession of CSM, also resolving things that began way back in "Anasazi". I can't believe you found all of this unsatisfying.

Chris Carter's very suspect directing in TRATB contribute to an experience that is absolutely torturous (he nailed it first time with 'Duane Barry', but rarely matched that directorial success again).

Again, total disagreement. What about the whole flashback memory sequence of Scully on the bridge, the UFO flying overhead with Cassandra being abducted from her wheelchair and ascending into the sky, all shot in reverse to get the snowflakes moving upward. You call that a suspect directing job?

As for not matching the directorial achievement of "Duane Barry", while I would agree that "The List" is not all the notable (although not without it's visual merits given the prison set), "The Post-Modern Prometheus" is nothing less than a masterpiece. There's far too much visual and stylistic brilliance in that episode to list. Then "Triangle", with huge sequences shot all in one take, with the odd necessary cheat disguised very well. Also "How the Ghosts Stole Christmas", another visual beauty with great sweeping camera moves, a clever bag of tricks in the haunted house, plus drawing excellent performances from its two leads and guests. Then there is "Patience", recapturing the stylistic atmosphere of Vancouver for the first time in Los Angeles, and not to mention "Improbable" with it's stunning choreography and superb attention to detail in reflecting all the numerical references, its music-video-like sequences and it's awe-inspiring final pull back amongst the carnival.

Mulder actually being buried for several months (which after a slight bout of PTSD - and by that I mean a few seconds of it - he cheerfully forgets), all manner of silliness.

How funny, there are a great many fans who moan endlessly about the way that Mulder demonstrates too much of an attitude upon his return. Talk about a no-win scenario.

[Guest ModernDayMoriarty]

I'll just give my rebuttals to those points you mentioned. Broadly we seem to agree, but I wouldn't be being honest to my nature if I didn't stand up for my convictions so:

Your definition of good action is certainly not the same as mine it seems. Merely having scenes in which a gun is fired or a punch is thrown does not make a good action episode. Just watch an episode like 'Essence' for example, and you'll see that Carter has come a long way in terms of his confidence with action set pieces. The early episodes have little action, but Carter masks this by superior atmosphere and tension. That only goes so far however, and later episodes would require much stronger action sequences.

Episodes like 'Colony', 'Endgame', Anasazi etc are either written by others, or have others lending a hand in the writing. Without others, Carter usually reverts to type. Thus, episodes like 'Blessing Way' and 'Paper Clip' which use action sparingly in very small doses. Whereas Carter usually implies action or threatens action, Spotnitz gives action and episodes with his name somewhere on the bill have far more fights, shoot outs, running, jumping etc.

And again, it works for a great deal of the time, but every now and then you just felt like you wanted something more. And Carter was wise enough to get people in to assist with the audience's desire for prolonged fights and physical action. Let's not forget that the idea of the alien bounty hunter came from David D. The big scrap with Krychek was in a CC/DD co-authored episode. In both TXF and MLM, Carter episodes remain action-lite. Mulder is infamous for his routine failure to beat hardly anyone in close combat!

Again, I'm not knocking a style that produced so many classics. But the series did need action orientated episodes, and I think Spotnitz was a big help with this. Him and DD may rely on their 'That's look awesome!' meter more than Carter, but sometimes you need that.

Piper Maru I remained completely unconvinced by. The fact that we have to sit here wondering about nonsense like 'how could the pilot survive?' is just proof to me that it was more trouble than it was worth for a cheap thrill. As to the killer of Scully's sister being caught... I thought it was a feeble end to that story quite frankly. Time and time again, Scully is shelved in importance and this was no exception. The scenes had no weight whatsoever, and the need to explain why they were being left alive by the Syndicate yet again was becoming wearing. You think they would at least circulate Mulder and Scully's picture to their men after a while...

It's worth pointing out that Piper Maru/Ap is pretty much where The X-Files started to lose the British vote. I'm not saying they were dreadful episodes. They were reasonably entertaining action fare, but it signalled more treading water as far as resolving the plot was concerned. The conspiracy getting wider is just another way of saying you are padding it out. After the excellent 'Paper Clip' and Nisei 2 parter, this was an unwelcome departure.

It's just the way it goes over here. We have never had much tolerance for high concept shows that overstay their welcome, because it all becomes so familiar and obviously stretched out. The lack of resolution led to a massive drop off in ratings. Like I said before, I do respect much of the mythtogy these days, but the end of S3, through seasons 4 and 5, the episodes are just painful, going absolutely nowhere.

With regard to the film... it pitched for both audiences and got none of them. The opinion over the years by hardcore fans seems to have been very much 'It was okay I guess'. I don't think I really saw anyone who thought it was fantastic, and the critics certainly didn't. Non fans pass it over also, because it has no spectacle to it, and is too talky/looks too cheap/too low on stars etc etc. I personally consider it a big waste of time really. All it showed was that whilst Carter was master of the TV medium, he has a long way to go before he can say the same for film.

The Flashback sequence in 'The Red and the Black' is a prime example of why Chris Carter should not have directed it. It was a great looking sequence, great idea for a sequence, but it was terrible! Utterly ruined by Gillian Anderson (presumably with Carter's urging and/or approval behind the camera) screaming 'OH0 MY GOD!!!' over and over again. I just can't watch it; it's too cringe inducing.

And as for Triangle and How the Ghosts... well, each to their own, but I found both of them (in terms of the scripts also) to be insufferable. I don't begrudge Carter his attempts to forge a new path for himself (presumably emboldened by his sucess on TPMP), but I just can't stand either of those episodes. It's a small price to pay though in mind to have a happy Carter. Season 6 has a tremendous sense of energy and new motivation, so I figured let him have his fun - there were more than enough great episodes elsewhere to satisfy me.

I didn't think much of Patience though (from a directorial point of view - I liked the episode itself). I seem to recall a quote from Carter (it may be on the DVD features actually) saying he wished he hadn't shown the monsters face so clearly (something he also regretted about 'The Host'). I agree with that (both times). I didn't know 'Improbable' (or didn't remember anyway) was directed by Carter. That was indeed a grand episode (again less for the directing which is fun, but for the idea itself and Burt's great perfomance).

I respectfully disagree with fans who claim Mulder has an attitude problem when he returns. He is the same as always. He is paranoid and suspicious because of Doggett literally taking over where he left off. His early rage is simply territorialism. Doggett has taken his land, and perhaps even his woman after all! None of it translates to the PTSD, because as I said Mulder recovers alarmingly well after that sole episode.

I greatly enjoy the Mulder/Doggett clashes. It's a shame there wasn't time for more of them really. I vastly prefer it to the hideously lovey dovey Mulder and Scully scenes towards the end of Season 8 (and the e-mail scene in S9). I find the end of 'Existence' as touching as the next man, but I'm not sure how much more of their domestic bliss act I could have taken...

Overall, I think The X-Files had a good run with its mythology. It's a shame that it couldn't have moved along in a timely enough fashion to keep Europe's interest, but that is the way American television goes I guess. It's a double edged sword. You want to keep the show going whilst it's popular, but the story suffers because you have to keep padding it out. With the benefit of hindsight and DVDs where we can skip episodes however, it becomes easier to forgive.

It is a shame though as I say, because nowadays The X-Files doesn't get the respect it deserves here in Britain (because most never made it past S4). It is never repeated on terrestial and is referred to as a 'cult show that was big for a time'.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

Your definition of good action is certainly not the same as mine it seems. Merely having scenes in which a gun is fired or a punch is thrown does not make a good action episode.

Well, regardless of whether or not you think the action was well-executed, you can't argue that it's there, written into the scripts. The entire teaser sequence to "The Erlenmeyer Flask" is ample proof of that. Maybe you thought such scenes to not come across well on screen, but that's the job of the director. From my point of view, I think all the episodes I previously listed show ample evidence that Chris Carter is quite capable to write action scenes and has done so on numerous occasions from relatively early on in the series.

I acknowledge that you disagree with me on this, but I would like to know what more you would want in terms of action.

Just watch an episode like 'Essence' for example, and you'll see that Carter has come a long way in terms of his confidence with action set pieces.

I think that's much more to do with the growth in budget and better and more experienced directors than it does with Carter's writing.

Episodes like 'Colony', 'Endgame', Anasazi etc are either written by others, or have others lending a hand in the writing.

Carter wrote the entirety of "Anasazi" alone. All David Duchovny did was have his input on the story premise. He didn't go anywhere near the script.

Thus, episodes like 'Blessing Way' and 'Paper Clip' which use action sparingly in very small doses.

"Paper Clip" is largely acknowledged by crew-members and fans alike as an action-packed, fast-paced and excellently-written episode. I concur.

The big scrap with Krychek was in a CC/DD co-authored episode.

Again, "Anasazi" was authored solely by CC. Unless you're referring to a different episode?

It's worth pointing out that Piper Maru/Ap is pretty much where The X-Files started to lose the British vote.

Here's something you may not know -- I myself am British.

The show certainly didn't lose my vote at this point, and I would also disagree with your assertion that it lost the overall British vote. On the contrary, it wasn't long before this that the show switched from airing on BBC2 to BBC1, which is a huge thing that little to no other US shows have ever done, plus it continued to do well on Sky One, and the newly-launched series of FILE videos were given strong publicity campaigns (I still have a large WH Smiths poster that advertised "82517"). Also, the PC and Playstation game was not far off being released. I would suggest that the show's popularity here in the UK didn't really start to wane until S6, which is pretty much in sync with the US audience.

With regard to the film... it pitched for both audiences and got none of them. The opinion over the years by hardcore fans seems to have been very much 'It was okay I guess'.

Again, I completely disagree. As a hardcore fan myself, I can say that certainly wasn't my reaction. I'm not saying it was perfect, but I certainly view it as a success and more than a worthy representation of The X-Files in macrocosm.

The Flashback sequence in 'The Red and the Black' is a prime example of why Chris Carter should not have directed it. It was a great looking sequence, great idea for a sequence, but it was terrible! Utterly ruined by Gillian Anderson (presumably with Carter's urging and/or approval behind the camera) screaming 'OH0 MY GOD!!!' over and over again. I just can't watch it; it's too cringe inducing.

The scenes in the actual hypnosis room could certainly have been better, but that's almost exclusively because of Gillian Anderson's performance, something you can never lay entirely at the director's feet. Yes, a director is responsible for giving actors their approach and such, but the only person that can be responsible for Gillian Anderson's performance is Gillian Anderson. She's the only one who can control what she does. But regardless of this, surely you can't deny that the huge sequence on the bridge in the actual flashback is an amazing feat of technical work that looks brilliant on camera?

And as for Triangle and How the Ghosts... well, each to their own, but I found both of them (in terms of the scripts also) to be insufferable.

Maybe the story or the lines weren't your cup-of-tea, but from a directing stand-point, are you not impressed by the Rope inspired one-take approach to "Triangle", surely one of the hardest things a director can possibly task himself with doing?

It is never repeated on terrestial and is referred to as a 'cult show that was big for a time'.

That's solely because the BBC no longer has the rights to the show. You'll find it repeated constantly on Living TV and FX. It's entirely because of money, nothing to do with popularity.

[Libby]

I've been following this discussion, but the two of you are way ahead of my abilities to get involved. It's a coincidence, but today I started transcribing CC's commentary for The Red and The Black (for my website) and I was struck by CC's comment on this regression hypnosis scene:

I actually went to Harvard and sat with the now-deceased Dr John Mack who was the man who had done the original work, scientific investigation into the existence of extraterrestrials that the X-Files was really kind of based on. I had been allowed to go to his place of work and sit in on a regression hypnosis which is how I ended up writing this sequence, I actually got to sit next to someone who claimed they'd been abducted by aliens like Scully is here, and feel the power of that memory recalled by Dr Mack who had hypnotized this person I was sitting next to. It was an amazing experience for me to first of all be allowed to do it, because it was very personal for the person, and the person who allowed me to do it was extraordinary, and then to sit there and actually witness this. And I still admit to being a skeptic but the power of sitting next to someone who goes through their abduction again, the pain of it, just like Scully had done there, was freaky for me.

I guess it's a case of how a scene plays out differently for different people, depending on their own experience and views.

This doesn't add to the discussion, because it's what's on the screen that counts rather than the behind-the-scenes stuff, but I thought you both might be interested.