A Step Too Far For Fringe?

[ethsnafu]

This post has been brought to you courtesy of Danny's laptop.

Dear friends,

I am not an avid viewer of "Fringe", I catch it here and there when it is on but not with any passion or with any real understanding of the show but I can clearly see the legacy of "The X-Files" in what bits I have seen. I do commend those involved for not pretending otherwise, they wear their hearts on their sleeves regarding their love of the show and have paid homage to it in the past. To respectfully doff your cap to your televisual ancestor is one thing but to blatantly align yourself with it is another. Whilst idly catching the odd moments of the episode "A New Day In An Old Town", an episode which establishes the antagonists as shapeshifters, the Fringe department faces closure in a government investigation into its financial validity and the following claim is made during the courtroom scenes.

SENATOR: Unsubstantiated claims of invasion. Reports of technology run amok. The old "X" designation and your fringe investigations have been indulgences in the federal budget for over half a century. Well, the salad days are over, Mister Broyles.

Hmm. I couldn't view that scene as anything other than an obvious attempt to claim that "The X-Files" and "Fringe" exist withing the same universe. They bought a certain portion of their audience by promoting it as an XF inspired project and went further in respectfully winking at the franchise in a Mulder and Scully caveat but caveats, homages, doffs and winks are a world away from what I took to be something much bolder and possibly disrespectful.

Fox owns the XF brand, We all know that. If Fringe-folk were pencil-chewing one afternoon during a writers meeting about whether or not to write that line I am sure Fox would have given them carte blanche to go ahead but I doubt that CC had any say if his creation was to be allied to "Fringe" in this way. Of course it's a moment, and an issue, that only matters to the fanboys and the pedants but it mattered to me. "Fringe" has traded on XF in the past (there is plenty of online evidence to support the assertion that XF viewers tuned in to a particular episode solely to see the Mulder and Scully nod and I'm sure that possibility was not lost on those who wote it) but to assert that the fringe division is the new incarnation of the OLD X devision seems a little to far for my liking.

I assume Philes have been all over this point already. Maybe I'm reading too much into it? Maybe my knickers are twisted for no good reason but I'd be interested to hear your thoughts.

Should the writers of "Fringe" be allowed to allude to the fact that "Fringe" and "The X-Files" take place in the same conceptual universe?

Laptop now being passed to it's rightful owner.

Eth

[Guest teedub]

I don't have a problem with them existing in the same universe. Or perhaps that should be the same *parallel* universe. In fact, I would even get a kick out of a more minor character guesting on Fringe. Might I suggest Skinner?!

What I have problems with is when Fringe out-and-out takes XF episodes and basically re-films them. Well, that's an exaggeration. But they have on occasion taken a basic XF ep plot and made a Fringe ep out of it. I don't like that. Be creative!

But I can tell you one thing that Fringe has done better. The hero-heroine love story. The tease between Mulder and Scully went on so long that when they eventually *did* get together, it was anticlimatic. The Olivia-Peter storyline on Fringe has been handled much better, perhaps more realistically? And they have been brought together early on so we don't get that will-they-won't-they drag.

This coming from a 1990s X-Phile and a new millennium Fringe-phile.

[model217]

I don't have a problem with it as long as it is just paying homage. I think that gives fans loyal to X-Files a bit of a grin. I don't want to think of Fringe being in the same verse with The X-Files anymore than than I would want to see Fringe and Charlie Jade in the same universe. And you have to admit the last few episodes of Fringe felt more like Charlie Jade than The X-Files.

[ethsnafu]

I understand what you are saying and for viewers who enjoy both shows I am sure the nods are welcome but I'm empathising with Chris Carter which may or may not be justified. I have read interviews in which it was suggested to him that a XF/MM crossover might be a desirable way to prop up Millennium should the, at that time, infant show struggle to find an audience and despite his acknowledgment that that would be one way of salvaging the show should it fail he was at pains to stress that he didn't want to go down that route. He spoke, in a number of interviews, of how incongruent he felt the two universes were. When Morgan and Wong brought MM and XF into alignment with "Jose Chung's Doomsday Defense" it is interesting to note that the third season of Millennium, a season receiving more input from CC, cast doubt upon that by having an episode of XF play in the background of an episode. It was only when the show was cancelled that CC, I assume, had no option but to utilise the XF universe to afford fans of Millennium a degree of closure cancellation denied them. Prior to this he had stated that the XF universe was, in his words, sacred and the only situation that could arise by which he consider aligning the two shows was if a desire was expressed by Gillian or David to do that. The point I am making is that if CC considered the XF universe a sacred concept, one which he couldn't conceive of bringing Millennium into in ideal circumstances, is it fair that others are now able to allign their creations with his, probably without his blessing?

With 20th Century Fox giving their blessing to a XF/30 Days Of Night crossover (one which Frank Spotnitz expressed surprise about) and now Fringe writers now moving from nods and winks to more audacious hints that the two shows exist in the same universe it just seems a tad unfair that Chris Carter's creative property is now being used by others willing to trade on its legacy and success despite his former reticent at muddying XF unless there was a legitimate, creative reason to do so.

Maybe I am wrong and CC maybe was consulted with regards to the line in Fringe but given Frank's evident surprise at the XF/3DON project I can't help but feel that isn't the case.

Y'know this is just me being all grouchy about Fringe isn't it. I was just surprised to see that line in the show to be honest.

Eth

[ty7du]

Ummm... They showed a clip from an X-Files show briefly on a TV in the beginning of season 2 of Fringe...blink and you miss it. But it was clearly, a shot of Mulder and a UFO overhead him, if I recall it correctly.

I've never looked at Fringe being in the same universe. Fringe does seem much more fantastical than X-Files...which is fine by me. I like Fringe but it's nothing you can really chew on, it's all very straight-forward. Who didn't see the second season story arc, it was after all given away in the end of season one. But Fringe is all the same a fun show. I never thought Joshua Jackson would be a good fit but he's pretty good...considering what he's been in before...

[Guest teedub]

Mark, I hear what you're saying. Creative property is such an oddity in Hollyweird. You can create something and never own it. Sad, really. But there it is. If Chris Carter had enough control that he had to be asked permission to mention his property, we probably would have had a Millennium movie 10 years ago.

I agree with CC in that XF and MM should never have occupied the same universe. XF was science fiction. (Hey! I'm not saying UFOs don't exist!) MM was the reality that we lived in. (Well, at least until Season 2 and show-destroyers Morgan and Wong came along. ) I felt it totally devalued MM when the two started crossing. But perhaps I, too, am just being grouchy about Morgan and Wong.

Josef, you took the words right out of my mouth in regards to Joshua Jackson. I was absolutely not expecting him to be this good nor was I expecting to like him this much in the show. Excellent casting all the way around (including guest casting).