What Episodes Made You Mad

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

I might have tipped this off in my last post, but the only episode that I can think of that made me mad was "13 Years Later", at least off the top of my head. The reason it made me mad was that I so much looked forward to Millennium every Friday and had such great expectations. Not only did I prefer the dark aspects of the show, but unlike some of the season two episodes mentioned in my last post, even the attempts at humor and cleverness failed in 13 Years, and after a week of waiting for a new Millennium episode, this episode made me feel like I was robbed and given something completely different. I know, the same can be said for many of the other episodes of it's kind, but to me, these other episodes were brilliant in different ways than classic Millennium, and therefore worked their way into my heart. 13 Years Later, however, never got off the ground and failed miserably. It is one of the few episodes that I disliked that I didn't enjoy even a little more when I watched it again with an open mind. Just my humble opinion.

[Guest Frank L.]

I might have tipped this off in my last post, but the only episode that I can think of that made me mad was "13 Years Later", at least off the top of my head. The reason it made me mad was that I so much looked forward to Millennium every Friday and had such great expectations. Not only did I prefer the dark aspects of the show, but unlike some of the season two episodes mentioned in my last post, even the attempts at humor and cleverness failed in 13 Years, and after a week of waiting for a new Millennium episode, this episode made me feel like I was robbed and given something completely different. I know, the same can be said for many of the other episodes of it's kind, but to me, these other episodes were brilliant in different ways than classic Millennium, and therefore worked their way into my heart. 13 Years Later, however, never got off the ground and failed miserably. It is one of the few episodes that I disliked that I didn't enjoy even a little more when I watched it again with an open mind. Just my humble opinion.

Although I enjoyed ...Thirteen Years Later, I think I know how you felt/feel. I had the same reaction to some of the comedy episodes of The X-Files. Especially in season 5, 6 and 7 they started doing too much of these and getting further and further away from what made the show so great. The only seasons from TXF that don't have a single comedy episode are 1 and 8. These might just be my favorite seasons. Not that I don't like comedy episodes; I laugh 'till I cry when I see Small Potatoes, Bad Blood or Je Souhaite, but some things just don't work.

[Guest Moriarty]

Although I enjoyed ...Thirteen Years Later, I think I know how you felt/feel. I had the same reaction to some of the comedy episodes of The X-Files. Especially in season 5, 6 and 7 they started doing too much of these and getting further and further away from what made the show so great. The only seasons from TXF that don't have a single comedy episode are 1 and 8. These might just be my favorite seasons. Not that I don't like comedy episodes; I laugh 'till I cry when I see Small Potatoes, Bad Blood or Je Souhaite, but some things just don't work.

Hi Frank. I think you forgot season 2 from TXF. I mean, there is no comedy episode in it either. Or is there?

[Guest Frank L.]

Hi Frank. I think you forgot season 2 from TXF. I mean, there is no comedy episode in it either. Or is there?

Well, it depends on what you call a comedy episode, but 'Humbug' is generally seen as a funny ep, also because it was written by Darin Morgan.

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

Although I enjoyed ...Thirteen Years Later, I think I know how you felt/feel. I had the same reaction to some of the comedy episodes of The X-Files. Especially in season 5, 6 and 7 they started doing too much of these and getting further and further away from what made the show so great. The only seasons from TXF that don't have a single comedy episode are 1 and 8. These might just be my favorite seasons. Not that I don't like comedy episodes; I laugh 'till I cry when I see Small Potatoes, Bad Blood or Je Souhaite, but some things just don't work.

Yes, I agree, and the one you mention from season 2, Humbug, does qualify as one of these type episodes, and WAS a disappointment for me. I specifically remember being in Canada the night it aired, and hurrying home so I didn't miss the X-files. If I remember correctly, I did miss a few minutes, maybe even the first scene, but when it started up again, I remember thinking "what the heck is this". Although I do like some of the funny episodes throughout the series, this one still doesn't really do anything for me. X-files was a little different for me than Millennium because it was so much lighter, and I had a different mind set and different expectations when I tuned in. I wasn't quite so thrown off by the comedy stuff, especially sense there were so many one liners and funny dialogue or scenes, even in the serious episodes. Overall, I think I enjoyed the vast majority of the comedy episodes on X-files, including Small Potatoes, Bad Blood, and Je Souhaite, as you mention, as well as Clyde Bruckman, Syzygy, and Jose Chung to name a few. Oh, and I also liked Dreamland, although it seems to get mixed reviews here.

[Guest ZeusFaber]

Hello Zeus, my polar opposite. Once again we share an opposing view, as I really loved the episode. I wish I could dig up the thread where you elaborate on your dislike for the episode, but I can see where some people might not have liked it. It was far from typical Millennium. I have to admit, I didn't have fond memories of it after the first viewing, but it has really grown on me, and now that I am used to it, I really enjoy watching it. It seems like these "non serious" episodes are hit or miss with loyal MM watchers, and I have heard differing views on all of them. I, for example, can find absolutely no redeeming qualities in "13 Years Later", but love "Somehow Satan, Jose Chung and St. Sebastian. These type episodes probably, in many cases, add to the dislike that many have for season two. As mentioned, I tuned into these episodes expecting your typical dark, serious Millennium episodes, so it took me some time to accept them.

I think I ought to clarify, my dislike for "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" has nothing to do with any kind of devide between "serious" and "non-serious" episodes. Although you could regard me as a prototypical S2 objector, this is in no way due to any objection to light-hearted or comedic episodes. On the contrary, I think "Somehow, Satan Got Behind Me" and "Jose Chung's Doomsday Defence" are excellent.

Besides, I would definitely say that "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" is intended as a serious episode, albeit it one that attempts a little comic relief in very small doses. However, I do feel that it fails in every regard not only as an episode of Millennium, but as an hour of scripted drama. It is horribly cliched, and plays like it was written by a ten-year-old: the rediculously stereotyped German characters, the pantomime villain dressed in a long black trench coat and antique black hat, the adolescent need to force sleaze and pronography into the plot, the terrible dialogue given to Gotfred John's character...

Added to this is the globetrotting, tomb-raiding premise that leaps the show into a whole new genre, and the way that the Millennium Group is suddenly transmogrified into an ancient cult dating back a thousand years (in a poorly costumed and unconvincingly shot teaser sequence) when it was once a mirror of a real-life, down-to-earth organisation.

All the bombs, guns, chases, and European characatures make this the Saturday-morning version of the show in my eyes. It's not just that it changed the background and genre of the show, because there's always a chance that could have been for the better, but more the fact that it is so amatuerishly written. It feels like some teenagers playing dress-up and filming themselves in the back-yard, not a primetime network drama. I'd be a little embarassed to show this to anyone who'd never watched Millennium before and wondered why I was a fan.

Just to stress though, this is just my opinion and reaction to the episode. If I come across a little more scathing than usual, it's just because I'm trying to illustrate my viewpoint and explain why "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" is the first episode I think of when answering Joe's initial question.

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

I think I ought to clarify, my dislike for "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" has nothing to do with any kind of devide between "serious" and "non-serious" episodes. Although you could regard me as a prototypical S2 objector, this is in no way due to any objection to light-hearted or comedic episodes. On the contrary, I think "Somehow, Satan Got Behind Me" and "Jose Chung's Doomsday Defence" are excellent.

Besides, I would definitely say that "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" is intended as a serious episode, albeit it one that attempts a little comic relief in very small doses. However, I do feel that it fails in every regard not only as an episode of Millennium, but as an hour of scripted drama. It is horribly cliched, and plays like it was written by a ten-year-old: the rediculously stereotyped German characters, the pantomime villain dressed in a long black trench coat and antique black hat, the adolescent need to force sleaze and pronography into the plot, the terrible dialogue given to Gotfred John's character...

Added to this is the globetrotting, tomb-raiding premise that leaps the show into a whole new genre, and the way that the Millennium Group is suddenly transmogrified into an ancient cult dating back a thousand years (in a poorly costumed and unconvincingly shot teaser sequence) when it was once a mirror of a real-life, down-to-earth organisation.

All the bombs, guns, chases, and European characatures make this the Saturday-morning version of the show in my eyes. It's not just that it changed the background and genre of the show, because there's always a chance that could have been for the better, but more the fact that it is so amatuerishly written. It feels like some teenagers playing dress-up and filming themselves in the back-yard, not a primetime network drama. I'd be a little embarassed to show this to anyone who'd never watched Millennium before and wondered why I was a fan.

Just to stress though, this is just my opinion and reaction to the episode. If I come across a little more scathing than usual, it's just because I'm trying to illustrate my viewpoint and explain why "The Hand of Saint Sebastian" is the first episode I think of when answering Joe's initial question.

OK, now I wont have to try to dig up your old posts to find out why you didn't like the episode, but I already suspected many of the reasons, and based on your views of Owls and Roosters, I would have guessed that you would not have been pleased with this episode. As mentioned, I had to get used to the episode, and it was definitely different than any of the other episodes, including Owls and Roosters. It's hard to explain, and I'm sure you would disagree, but I think many of the aspects of this episode, especially regarding the German characters were intended to spoof some of the movies and shows that came before it and create a light and "not so serious" feel to the episode. To me, the episode is just fun, and the hilarious exchanges between Roedecker and Peter, as well as the reactions of Frank and Peter towards the German detective, make this one of the most amusing episodes. It's funny that there are such mixed opinions on this episode. I guess you either love it or you hate it. Also, many would find it interesting that the Millennial Abyss, which is usually more harsh than the average viewer, and known for some scores that seem unfairly low, gave the episode a rare 5 out of 5. While I enjoyed the episode, I can see and understand your point of view.

[Guest Moriarty]

Well, I am afraid I am not a big fan of THOSS either. I am with Zeus on this one: giving the group their origins in the middle ages was just, well, ridicilous I feel. And indeed, the whole sequence was poorly executed. But hey, this is really up to personal feelings. I just don't like the season 2 mythology involving the group. And THOSS was the first episode to deal with this, followed by Owls and Roosters, 2 episodes which I do not like either. So regarding Joe's question: those episodes kind of made me "mad". Besides, CC did not like the origins of the group established by M&W either. That was made clear in Matryoshka where he gave the group their origins during the days of Hoover at the FBI. For me that was far more reasonable than what THOSS showed...

Take care!

[Guest SouthernCelt]

For whatever its worth, from following the thread here, I have to conclude that where season 2 is concerned, fans either really, really like it or they really, really hate it. Doesn't seem to be much middle ground.

[Guest Moriarty]

For whatever its worth, from following the thread here, I have to conclude that where season 2 is concerned, fans either really, really like it or they really, really hate it. Doesn't seem to be much middle ground.

Southern: It is not that I hate season 2. Not at all. I think that there were some great episodes in it like The Mikado, MOTC, even the 2 partner season finale. BUT I do have a problem with the "group episodes". Don't know why but for some obscure reason the stories just bother me. So I don't hate the season but I don't love it either.