Hello, and you may not like this

[Guest Frank L.]

It is true that it's not the way Chris Carter wanted the show to continue. I think he never said it, but it's quite clear he doesn't really like the second season.

I agree on some points, but not on all of them. M&W did write some of the best episodes of the series IMHO (Owls/Roosters and The Fourth Horseman/The Time Is Now), but a lot of the great episodes from season 2 come from other writers (The Mikado, Anamnesis). Plus I think they put too much (bad) comedy into some episodes. A light moment is good, but they ruined The Hand Of St. Sebastian and Beware Of The Dog ("Sheriff") with it.

But this is my opinion, feel free to disagree. I used to think the second season was the best, but my view of the world has changed and now I believe the first season is the best.

[4th Horseman]

You write:

QUOTESorry, that's not what the show and the Group were supposed to be about.

How do you know?

Toby

I "know" because it felt right to have Frank join a group of like minded people.

CF - its very refreshing to see new members posting with such veracity and certitude. As a valued new member here, the first order of the day (as anyone who has been here for any length of time will validate) is that you MUST learn not to take responses from other members personally. Believe me, i have been there, just ask RavenWolf and The Old Man..you have contributed some very astute posts concerning the contrariety of Seasons 1,2,3.

I applaude your eagerness in sharing your viewpoints and hope in the future to read more of your expressions in regards to the prismatic spectrum that is MillenniuM...

With that being said, i dont recall any particular episode where it was made clear that the MillenniuM Group had incorporated its efforts with those of Legion. My thoughts on the issue, (verified by the episodes Owls, Roosters, and various others in S3) was that the MillenniuM Group's interest was much more of a secular nature than a spiritual one. Controlling WORLD events under the guise of Biblical prophecy in order to bring about "an apocalypse of our own creation".

Legion's theatre of operation was on more of a spiritual plane..the struggle for man's heart, mind, and soul

Eph. 6:12. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

The hospital scene between Lucy Butler and Frank in which she states "we could rule the world" is a clear example of a sempiternal attempt of Evil (as represented in this case by Lucy Butler) to entice Frank with the promise of power far beyond what any other mortal could ever hope to possess. The enticement of Aleister Pepper and The Judge, all an endgame to subjugate the enduring qualities of honor, mercy, innocence, and morality (which describes Frank Black) to the unrelenting, eternal darkness that is Evil....

4th Horseman...

[Guest CrusaderFrank]

You write:

QUOTESorry, that's not what the show and the Group were supposed to be about.

How do you know?

Toby

I "know" because it felt right to have Frank join a group of like minded people.

CF - its very refreshing to see new members posting with such veracity and certitude. As a valued new member here, the first order of the day (as anyone who has been here for any length of time will validate) is that you MUST learn not to take responses from other members personally. Believe me, i have been there, just ask RavenWolf and The Old Man..you have contributed some very astute posts concerning the contrariety of Seasons 1,2,3.

I applaude your eagerness in sharing your viewpoints and hope in the future to read more of your expressions in regards to the prismatic spectrum that is MillenniuM...

With that being said, i dont recall any particular episode where it was made clear that the MillenniuM Group had incorporated its efforts with those of Legion. My thoughts on the issue, (verified by the episodes Owls, Roosters, and various others in S3) was that the MillenniuM Group's interest was much more of a secular nature than a spiritual one. Controlling WORLD events under the guise of Biblical prophecy in order to bring about "an apocalypse of our own creation".

Legion's theatre of operation was on more of a spiritual plane..the struggle for man's heart and mind. The hospital scene between Lucy Butler and Frank in which she states "we could rule the world" is a clear example of a sempiternal attempt of Evil (as represented in this case by Lucy Butler) to entice Frank with the promise of power far beyond what any other mortal could ever hope to possess. The enticement of Aleister Pepper and The Judge, all an endgame to subjugate the enduring qualities of honor, mercy, innocence, and morality (which describes Frank Black) to the unrelenting, eternal darkness that is Evil....

4th Horseman...

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I don't take the criticism personally.

We all loved the show and are sorry that it's gone, and that as time passes, it's less likely that there will be a Millennium movie or reprisal.

As I said, the show had a great premise and was brought down by the rudderless stewardship of Morgan & Wong. Above all, killing Catherine was inexcusable. Frank and Catherines relationship was in decline when we first meet them. It would have been wonderful to do a back story and see what they saw in each other. How did Catherine get pregnant? Did the MG help? Catherine did her own battle against evil and mentioning that abused kids grow up to be abusers is an excellen way to contrast the nature of Evil; nature or nuture.

Is it any coincidence that Jennifer Hewitt's character on "Ghost Whisperer" drive a Red Jeep?

[HighPlainsDrifter]

i agree with you Horseman, i didnt like them killing off Catherine either. Killing Bletcher was fine but to kill off what i think was a very important character was just wrong. WE could of seen alot more great episodes in which she was a lead charcter instead of FRank

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

i agree with you Horseman, i didnt like them killing off Catherine either. Killing Bletcher was fine but to kill off what i think was a very important character was just wrong. WE could of seen alot more great episodes in which she was a lead charcter instead of FRank

It would be interesting to find out exactly why they did kill her off. The show obviously went on to a third season, but I wonder if ratings concerns were starting to present themselves by the end of S2. If so, maybe they relied on polls and viewer feedback of some sort and determined that Catherine was simply not liked by too many fans or was detracting too much from Lance's character. Maybe she wanted a bigger role and they wanted to go in a different direction. Maybe she pulled a David Caruso and thought her role in MM set her up to move on to bigger and better things. Then again, maybe she didn't get a big head but simply wanted to expand her career and try something new. It's hard to say. Based on what I have read here, opinions about Catherine seem to be mixed, with more positive than negative, but based on what little I had read about the series outside this web site, and from what I heard from fellow watchers, Catherine's character wasn't really that well loved. Either way though, she was such a big part of the show that I have to think there is more to it than meets the eye and that she wasn't written off the show strictly as a story line. Just my humble opinion.

[4th Horseman]

I wonder if ratings concerns were starting to present themselves by the end of S2.

You hit the nail on the head MIB...at the time of production, there was no guarantees that a 3rd season was going to be picked up by Fox, so i guess in order to provide some closure, there was a decision to kill off a main character...these are issues that are generally discussed in the interviews at the end of each season. There is a lot to be found concerning MillenniuM there..

4th Horseman...

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

I wonder if ratings concerns were starting to present themselves by the end of S2.

You hit the nail on the head MIB...at the time of production, there was no guarantees that a 3rd season was going to be picked up by Fox, so i guess in order to provide some closure, there was a decision to kill off a main character...these are issues that are generally discussed in the interviews at the end of each season. There is a lot to be found concerning MillenniuM there..

4th Horseman...

All I can say is thank God for season 3. It would have been so nice to have a just a couple more seasons to enjoy, but you can't have everything. It's a shame, but to me, nobody has been able to come up with a recipe that comes close to the X Files and Millennium. Don't get me wrong, there have been plenty of great shows sense then, but nothing that comes close to matching the kind of genius and originality that we enjoyed with Chris Carters two big series. Like I said, it would be nice to go through a good five years worth of seasons of MM on DVD before starting up again with S1, but I am still thankful, considering that S3 could have never happened and that it looked for so long like we might never see the series on DVD. Who knows though, I have barely seen a couple of clips of "Six Feet Under", so maybe that will be the next big series for me once I start renting the DVDs, meanwhile, I can't complain too much, I have my MM DVDs, my occasional X-files reruns, and there is still plenty of worth while programing out there.

PS, maybe I will get around to the interview discs at the end of the seasons one of these days. I have said this so many times that many here probably want to me or me or at the very least me, but as I have mentioned before, it keeps the episodes more real for me if I don't look at the behind the scenes stuff and the actors out of character. Just one of those pet peeves of mine.

[HighPlainsDrifter]

i have always felt that if Season 2 would of been handle differently we would of seen this series last till its 5th or even 6th season. My beef with Season 2 is the same with Lances thoughts. They made it into a fairy tale. To me there is maybe a hand full of episodes i love. Mikado and Luminary are on top of my list

[Guest MillenniumIsBliss]

i have always felt that if Season 2 would of been handle differently we would of seen this series last till its 5th or even 6th season. My beef with Season 2 is the same with Lances thoughts. They made it into a fairy tale. To me there is maybe a hand full of episodes i love. Mikado and Luminary are on top of my list

It's fun to hear all of these different opinions. It's kind of like we are all Millennium group members, but some of us are Owls, some of us are Roosters, and some of us just aren't sure. I think we have heard just about every variation, and none can be deemed right or wrong, just opinion. I myself loved S2, and think it was the best season, followed by S1, and then S3, although I have gained a new respect for S3 to a degree that I never thought was possible until being able to view it extensively this past year. I have now heard from people who loved S1, but thought the show then fell off and never recovered, people who loved S1, thought S2 got off track, and then recovered in S3, people who loved S1 and S2, and think S3 was junk, and like I said, just about every variation possible. As I mentioned many times, I think that MMs sister show, the X-files, veered off the beaten path on several occasions (IMHO), while I have no major problems with any of the MM seasons and all hold a special place in my heart. To me, S2 went on an amazing run of greatness that was only briefly interrupted on a few brief occasions. Not only do I seem to be in a slight minority on my S2 preference, but I also seem to be in the minority regarding the episodes that I didn't care for quite as much, such as Anamnesis, although, looking back, Sense and Antisense and Single Blade of Grass were the only sub par episodes. With my recent change of view that Anamnesis was better than I remembered, Single Blade of Grass is probably the closest to a stinker in S2. As mentioned before, I think the run from Curse of Frank Black through The Mikado was a string of pure, uninterrupted perfection. Anyway, it's hard to say where the series went off track, and I know I sound like a broken record, but I think there are just too many people out there who want brain candy and don't want to use their noggens to maintain ratings for a show like MM over the long run.

[Guest Noah]

Amen.

Reading all your posts, I realize I really need to get the DVDs ... and some time to watch them.

When MLM came around, I was a huge fan of The X-Files. But MLM quickly replaced it. I loved the darkness and the mystery - the things TXF I felt were giving up for this great alien conspiracy. Anyway, I soon found MLM more gripping. I cared more for Frank Black than for Mulder and Scully together. (Although I'm thinking that one day I will go back to TXF, which I was _such_ a fan of. And I guess it'd be nice to 'revisit' my teenage years that way.)

MLM's second season then totally blew my mind. I loved the show more every episode - until it was cancelled towards the end of the second season. I never really caught when it was finally aired (although I watched some episodes of season three, which didn't make any sense without the end of season two), but got to see all of season two and three when MLM was aired ago about two years ago.

I still enjoyed the second season more - the grander scope, the deeper mystery. It was darker in another way, and yet seemed more hopeful. The end was shocking, and for me season three as a whole never really reached that level again. Certain episodes had that certain Millennium-feeling to them, but overall the season didn't.

I guess what I want to say is that I agree with MIB. And I am very fond of religious, end-of-the-world stories, mysteries and conspiracies (but human rather than alien). I guess that then explains why I enjoyed season two most.